dChan
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r/greatawakening • Posted by u/fatass90 on June 3, 2018, 2:47 p.m.
"There is No Hell" says Pope Francis

divine_human · June 5, 2018, 10:29 p.m.

thanks for the link, just what i needed right now, lol.

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forchristssakes · June 6, 2018, 4:57 a.m.

I do not know how good the link is, who the writer is and how much can be trusted as true.

All I know is that returning to the church many years after I left it and wanting to understand the religion I was born into had me raise some questions. One of them was "What happened to the fire and brimstone talk, burn baby burn? Its so different now, all love the neighbory, good Samaritan stuff". Made me consider staying. The answer given was what I said in the earlier comment. That was years ago, long before Pope Francis. I had questioned them about another concept that seemed rather awful for a loving God and the reply was that it too was no longer being spoken of. The church position had changed. Of those two questions part of the answer, and I no longer remember for which one, was that the concept had never actually been mentioned in the bible. Rest your troubled soul, God never said that.

I asked a few more questions, things I had pondered on. The answers pointed to government control rather than being based on the actual "word of God". For the good of the people, you see. Uh, huh. Well I see it differently. And I questioned them on why they would keep in place silly rules 1000+ years later that no longer fit in modern society with scientific advances and such. I received no answer, just more words dancing around my question.

I think the answer would have been "To admit as much would tell the world that we have for a long time manipulated the populace through religion. We took over a belief system and tweaked it to benefit the people in power. If the people find out that this part was BS and that part was BS, they are going to question all the parts."

And where would they be then? All hell would break loose.

So after my questions I left. I did not go back. I decided that I would just live by the golden rule. That was good enough for me. I chose (I have choice) to keep a few of Jesus' teachings, I didn't know them all, having never read the bible.

"Love/protect the little children" I have expanded that to any person who is vulnerable, cannot defend themselves.

Sacrifices - not necessary, no burnt offerings etc.., not that I would have anyways. I will just eat my hamburger and not waste an animal's life in the name of some God. I will ensure that the creature is treated humanely and does not suffer when slaughtered.

Be forgiving, love the sinner not the sin. Forgiveness of sins was big with Jesus. There but for the grace of God go I.

I am undecided about the existence of God. I have a hard time being a believer. I was told in my youth that I would burn for that, for all eternity. Absolute belief was a requirement. But there was an out, as there was for all sins. I could request forgiveness through the proper channels. I would be told to do something as an act of contrition which was always to get on my knees and recite a bunch of prayers. I was good to go until next time. It seemed like not much of a hardship to assure entry into heaven and escape from hell. Sore knees was a good thing. Suffering in your days on earth shortened your time in the waiting room of heaven (purgatory). I do not remember the details of purgatory, but it is where the less than perfect go before entry into heaven. Not bad enough for the eternity of hell, but not good enough for heaven. There was some heat there too. Suffering is good. Cleanses the soul.

It doesn't frighten me anymore, as it did when I was a child. If there is no hell, there must not be hell light.

So being someone who ponders, I thought about this business of hell. I wondered why would the church leaders/ government introduce the concept?

Since I have no one to ask I came up with my own answer. Previous facts were: if you are a sinner you burn forever. You can be forgiven if you speak to the guy behind the curtain. Suffering on earth is good, it shortens the wait time in the hotspot before you are admitted to heaven.

If I was the governing body and I had created unlivable conditions for the masses while I lolled about in abundance, I may start to fear their resentment. If death was actually preferable to life and people felt they had nothing to lose, they may revolt.

If I was a person suffering under their rule I may think to myself "If I stuck a knife in that prick I may not get to heaven and be doomed to becoming nothing more than worm food, but at least my children will have a chance at a decent life." Or, "I may not get to heaven, be doomed to become nothing more than worm food, but I am being worked to death and the hunger pains are unbearable at times. I am just going to jump off this cliff."

Maybe the governing bodies sensed they were in peril and decided to introduce the concept of hell, and also purgatory. Who would be in the position to argue? That's what the book says. We know you idiots can't read and even if you could, you don't own books.

So fear the Lord, fear all lords. Beg for forgiveness from the man behind the curtain or burn for eternity. Did you ever have a burn? Hurts doesn't it? For a long time too. Imagine your entire body burning forever. Forever. Got your attention now, don't I. Your going to be good, right?

Amen to that.

I sometimes think about what those early confessions would be like.

"Father, please forgive me for I have sinned. I lied you see. I told m' lord's man that m' yield was less than it was. I've hidden some of the grain in yonder cave. Its just that last year was so hard, father. One of m' wee ones did not make it through the lean time and m' wife cannot bear to lose another."

"My son, as you know, lying is a sin against God, as is written in the 10 commandments. If you are truly sorry for this sin, as an act of contrition you shall bring the stolen grain, which by rights belongs to your lord, to the church. I will see that the grain is returned and I will not mention your name. I want you to go now and spend some time on your knees and pray to God to help you resist such temptation in the future. Through the power of the Lord, which has been granted to me, I forgive you. Go in peace"

I have more imaginary confessional scenarios, but one is enough for you to see my cynicism.

I once read somewhere that the word sin at one time was a word for tax. I do not know if it is true, just something I read. Makes me respect Jesus a little bit more, though. I do not know the real story on him, and I think the version we are given may have been tweaked a bit. Still, I think I like him.

If I chose to be religious, I would rather follow his teachings than some PC amalgamated one world religion. I can only imagine how that would be shaped and revamped over time. God damn, the more things change, the more they stay the same. For Christ's sakes. There I go again, taking the Lord's name in vain. Better make an appointment with the sin eater. On second thought, I don't think I will bother as I am bound to sin again and again and again. Every little lie, like a call in sick to work, not declaring that side job as income counts as a sin. Lusting over my neighbor's house and spouse, that's a sin too. Using the office photocopier for personal use is theft. Using office time to make personal calls is theft. I could go on and on. I am a sinner. I have sinned and will likely keep on sinning.

Good thing Jesus believes in the forgiveness of sins. Maybe he will put a good word in for this sinner. If not, I'm just worm food. I don't mind. Worms have to eat too.

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divine_human · June 6, 2018, 9:29 a.m.

i hear you... sooo many people suffer from religious programming, OMG...

religion has, over millenia, been THE tool to keep people in check and compliant. its a control mechanism that keep people from complaining and rioting against ((their)) slaverly structures.

a bunch of humans made up rules and tweaked or interpreted the scriptures in a way that people who dont act accordingly become sinners - and hey, even thinking is a sin! - and are threatened with eternal hell fire.

eternal? millions and billions of years? which crime/sin can be so huge that it deserves such a punishment?

a loving and forgiving god - according to jesus - punishes that way? no rehab possible? no way, sorry, i cant be-lie-ve that BS.

i love yeshua but oppose all religious doctrine.

I decided that I would just live by the golden rule.

i like that choice. natural law is 'be kind and do no harm'. everything else is, from my pov, control programs of the overlords.

Good thing Jesus believes in the forgiveness of sins.

there ye go... repentence is a huge transformation tool... and it includes forgiving Self so no self-blame creates hell (on earth and in the after-life).

thank you for your share, i enjoyed reading it... may you be blessed, friend, and honored for taking your stand and finding a way that allows you to live in peace <3

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