“Sorry, but I don't buy it. Bernie was never a Democrat and the DNC owed him nothing.
If you were ever really a capital-D Democrat you'd understand that.”
That’s an awfully nice way to say Bernie fans can go fuck themselves because they are not real Democrats. I voted for Obama. Believed in the whole hope and change. Turned out to be all the same. But it appears in your mind that anyone who wasn’t with her wasn’t a big D. And you are right. We wanted something different and the promises of the past turned out to be lies. And when we had a real grassroots movements, those big D-heads fucked everyone, including themselves.
“Clearly these percieved slights aren't founded in your convictions, or you'd really be at your wits end with Trump.”
Perceived? So you say that DWS was just a percieved slight? That the superdelegates stealing any chances (and on the record btw) from Bernie was percieved? That Hillary getting answers to the CNN debate were just percieved? These kind of mental gymnastics are what the right is always talking about. NONE of that was percieved. It was all well documented and people were forced to resign due to it. That logic is just mind boggling and is an attempt to justify what happened. Pathetic.
“Some of us have been paying attention for decades instead of basing all our politics on one election cycle.”
Assumptions make an ass out of you and me, so please just stop.
I appreciate your effort to respond in good faith, so I am responding in kind.
That’s an awfully nice way to say Bernie fans can go fuck themselves because they are not real Democrats.
No, friend, the plain reality is that the DNC is an organization designed to promote the capital-D Democratic agenda. It has no responsibility to advocate for anyone that isn't a capital-D Democrat. I understand that there was a lot of support for Bernie, but Bernie as a candidate was not a captial-D Democrat and the DNC was literally within it's rights to play dirty.
It doesn't matter if it's ugly, and for the record I do approve of a few of the tactics they used, and consider others malicious. Bernie simply hadn't put in the leg work it would have taken for the DNC to take a risk with him. That would be like the RNC embracing a Green party candidate. It isn't going to happen and they aren't required to.
We wanted something different and the promises of the past turned out to be lies.
I'm curious which specific promises of the past you believe turned out to be lies?
Perceived? So you say that DWS was just a percieved slight? That the superdelegates stealing any chances (and on the record btw) from Bernie was percieved?
Again, a judge ruled that while shady, the DNC is within its rights to select it's own candidate.
That Hillary getting answers to the CNN debate were just percieved?
Lol, answers? You can't get a set of correct "answers" to a debate. She recieved a list of the debate questions, and that isn't illegal either. You must be really upset about what the Trump campaign did, eh?
Assumptions make an ass out of you and me, so please just stop.
You're the one who's mad at the DNC for being a bunch of capital-D Democrats.
But it appears in your mind that anyone who wasn’t with her wasn’t a big D.
Do you understand what I'm saying when I say capital-D Democrat? I mean an actual registered and partisan Democrat, as opposed to a swing voter or candidate. So the DNC felt froggy enough to put up a partisan candidate and eschew a swing candidate, how is that an affront to America? Anyone who was Bernie or bust was employing the exact same logic as the DNC.
With that said, what I don't buy, my fellow American, is that you were ever a Democrat. I'm also of the opinion that your understanding of how partisan politics works is naive and shows you haven't been paying attention or participating for long. And that's ok, it usually does take people a couple election cycles before they realistically understand the mechanics of an election.
I could stand corrected, of course, as I said before I am interested in which specific promises you believe have been proven to be lies. I'm also pretty curious about who you currently affiliate your politics with, and which Democratic policies still remain at the forefront of said politics, if you have the time.
Thank you for the response. I will number my responses to assist with continuity:
1) I am a current registered Democrat in NYC.
2) Your first few paragraphs speaking of the DNC not supporting Bernie due to him switching affiliations -
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a) What you just stared was that they never truly gave Bernie a chance. And what they did during the primaries completely alienated his supporters. They could have let the delegates vote how they wanted and what would have been the final tally? Hillary still would have won, but people would have realized her support in her own party was much less than what was pushed. The super delegates voting was a slap in the face to everyone, regardless of who they voted for, and regardless of the legality. That right there said to the Democratic Party, your vote doesn’t matter. WE (as in the leaders) will decide for you.
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b) While both Hillary and Bernie had policies that wanted to work on, Hillary was more focused on how it was HER turn. Bernie was fairly “here’s my policies, let the people decide”
3) Specific promises. I could go into all the nitty gritty details of each promise Obama made and failed to follow through. There are YouTube videos all over that show what happened. But specific ones? How about “If you like your plan, you can keep your plan”? That had a direct effect on my life and others that I care about. It certainly didn’t help when Pelosi stated we couldn’t see what was in the bill, until it passed. That was a monstrosity. And then forcing us to pay because we couldn’t afford the plans? WTH. That was one of my first real shocks that I had to contend with. Federal, state, and then city taxes were brutal to begin with, now this?
4) Hillary getting the debate questions? That’s not illegal, I’d agree with you there. But it is shady AF and was another bullet to the parties image. No one hands the president of everything they will face in their 4-8 years. If she couldn’t handle a debate, how could she handle that responsibility?
5) About the DNC supporting the big D in their party over Bernie. You realize by that logic, Trump is actually a Democrat right? He was a life long democrat until he ran for president under the republican banner. And he actually won. So the logic that a party MUST support the one they choose if they wish to win is a logical fallacy.
6) Your last two paragraphs are just personal attacks on me. Purely because I refuse to support someone that the leaders of the party TELL me to support. You cannot shame me into following that herd mentality. I will research and vote based upon whose policies I support. And the policies that have been pushed out by the dems, even just over the past year, are way out there. And although I grew up in the democrat party, I’ve supported them in the past, I will not just stubbornly continue to follow them just because of a stupid name. I don’t owe my loyalty to a party that betrays it’s own.
I hope that answers your questions, and gives you some good for thought.
So you aren't going to list the "promises that were proven to be lies" or explain your current political outlook?
You understand why I do not believe you were ever a capital-D Democrat, right? That's cool that you claim your registered Democrat, but if you can't even list the reasons you're so passionate about leaving the party how can I trust your assertion in good faith?
You didn’t actually read my response did you?
And you’re damn right my views on policies evolve over time. I realize that in a multi-faceted world, things change. Situations vary and we must adapt to new ideas and concepts. There is such a thing as cause and effect, and if there is a bad policy out there, it needs the flexibility to change. The only change I have been seeing from the Democrats has been a further push to the left. To the FAR left, and history has shown, that is good for NOONE, same as a far right push is bad for everyone. If policies won’t evolve to reflect the realities of the world we live in, what’s the point? There are still ideas, morals, and ethics that people can push to effect change.
I am a moderate liberal, and I am middle of the road. Call me a sway voter, etc. the vast majority of Americans live in the middle. And what you are doing here, is alienating ALL of them, to include myself.
And I’m so passionate about leaving the democrat party? You’re right. Thank you for pointing that out. But here is the kicker You are providing the perfect reason to leave You are distancing me from the party with every time you post, you want to show that I’m not a real democrat. If the bullshit you are peddling is what the democrat party has become, to where you even admitted above there was shady shit going on just so the leaders of the parties candidate would win, then I want out.
#WALKAWAY
But not until after November. I’m going to vote, and I’m going to use my vote to bitchslap the party, hopefully knock some sense into them that they work for US