Here's a theory.

What if (you) , as in the wearer, are the power source? Everyone keeps saying "muh power sores" but has anyone considered using the human body as the hydraulic element? or at the very least a component of greater or lesser value. Human muscle fibers can be incredibly powerful, and if given an electric charge can quite literally throw a man across a room. If that man also happened to be a meat head body builder, then all the better.

For this you would need an amped up electrical impulse device connected directly onto or into your muscles, or some variation of that. (Note that the imperium doesn't use AI, but instead half living people in place of it, and that most imperium citizens are cyborgs to some degree) Once you have done that, you could likely hook up some kind of energy generation device onto moving parts to charge and power electrical systems that your suit may have, along with amplifying your muscle power by several times, combine that with a suit that can support it's own weight and your in business.

To put on the armor, you could use some kind of ironman/halo contraption to put it on you, or simply have someone bolt it on from top to bottom. Improvements can be made, but this is preliminary stuff

After all, what kind of ultra marine comes off as a scrawny little faggot to you?

>>685595

>>685585

For the Emperor, comrades. Every man must be willing to give every fiber of his being for the Emperor, even if the end result is him dying (but who honestly expects him to survive in the first place?)

> Fucks up the nerves, muscles, tendons and bones, this not only screws up the person later in the meantime also makes them weaker.

Cyborgs, every person in the imperium is one to some degree, might aswell go all the way and become a beast of war.

>>685595

As a side note the survival of the wearer is optional, especially when considering that in most lore's, the wearer (ie ultra marine, master chief) pretty much never take off their armor, or only doing so after a number of years. But for the sake of lore, they wear it until they die, which is really all one should expect from a juggernaut cyborg war machine anyways.

>>685767

Genetic modification is a part of that. From what I understand about power armor lore and the like, it takes 3 main things. 1st, is of course the suit, 2nd is the human, and 3rd is the control apparatus, in no specific order, yet.

You must have the man as powerful as is possible and/or reasonable. After that you must have a way to amplify what existing power the man has already to multiply it. Then comes the suit. The suit would nominally be simpler than the man in terms of engineering and manufacture. The suit needs to have a way of transferring the force of the man directly to the suits exterior, and also be strong enough to withstand it. The suit would also be a part of the chain in power amplification, but it would be manually/mechanically operated than electronically assisted (unless your a weak sissy that is). The biggest issue I can forsee with the suits is that it has to interact in such a way that neither man nor machine is digging into the other, meaning there are no tight spots that may pinch his muscles, and similar spots that could be damaged by the mans mass. The man and the machine have to meld in a sort of symbiotic relationship where both promote the other.

Such an undertaking would require a vast amount of knowledge of many subjects. It would need genetic technology, cybernetic technology, and various kind of materials that may exist but are unknown as of now.

I feel that it is possible, only that it would require the utmost sacrifice on the end of the wearer, and many hours of research and development on the side of the creators. There is even a possibility that they already exist and have been perfected in some way, but are hidden for obvious reasons. Or perhaps our very conversation is being taken into account for a silent ongoing project.

>>685800

>Let me put it this way, your army is now entirely comprised of biological Panzerjager Ferdinands.

>A dank maymay but completely worthless.

No one said to exclusively field those kinds of troops, even in the 40k universe ultra marines are uncommon at best, the imperium still uses basic infantry to fight most battles, only calling upon the astartes when a normal human isn't enough.

>Unfortunately the laws of physics get in the way, since nothing that we're made out of is strong enough to handle doing either of those things in a vague human shaped/sized package.

That's where the suit comes in. I doubt punching a tank to death is very economical, but I doubt it would have any problem flipping a military vehicle, even if it's merely tipping it over in a completely non dramatic way. The main purpose of the man being pure raw power isn't necessarily to beat people to death but instead to maintain a moderate level of mobility while being covered in armor and carrying around an auto cannon. Being able to crush a man skull between your mechanized fingers is just a bonus. Add in some space magic jetpacks and shocks (if his bestial legs aren't enough) and you have the man sized equivalent of a yellow jacket made out of metal.

>>685853

>being this afraid of genetically modified giga-chads

How are they self-destructing anyways? Just supply their needs in high quantities and they'll be fine. If all goes well they won't self-destruct, it will however be tedious and risky at best during the process of becoming.

This shit isn't even about taking on tanks directly, hell even in modern combat you wold be better suited with technicals and rpg's to take on armor. In the history of tanks their main role is to attack, that has been their sole purpose in warfare, not as defenders. They are essentially siege machines that can take hard hits because an attacking force is almost always at a disadvantage.

The whole point of power armor isn't to take on tanks, we already have shit for that. It is instead for the purpose of BTFOing common infantry with negligible risks towards the operator. Since most infantry combat has a high attrition rate in the first place, it seems completely reasonable to have a small squad of men capable of soaking up bullets like a sponge as opposed to having entire divisions worth of men soaking it up. It's a game of force multiplication, and a squad of these kinds of men would save countless lives, hell, every bullet, rock, or piece of shrapnel that dings off their impenetrable hide would be the equivalent of a regular dying.

Even if the giga-chads were to die, it would still be worth it in the sheer numbers of lives they saved. To me, the hellish life and death those few would have is a fair trade off to spare countless other regular soldiers.

>>686016

I found something the other day which may make the suits even more feasible with less weight. UHMWPE, really tough as fuck polymer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra-high-molecular-weight_polyethylene

Apparently it's easy-ish to work with as you only need to heat it up to form it, the page says that it's stronger than steel, but weaker than teflon, yet has a higher abrasion resistance than teflon. Biggest downside would be the price tag, for a piece of 1x12x24 UHMWPE it would be ~80 burgerbucks, but is actually cheaper than the same size in steel which comes to ~140US

(steel also weights ~80lbs compared to UHMWPE which would weigh about 10lbs according to pic related)

>>686030

They would be bestial men, they would have to consume like a gallon or two of some calorie dense shake with all of their daily vitamins, minerals, carbs, proteins, etc. they would quite literally drink like a horse (seeing as how they could easily be as big or bigger than a horse)

>>686035

Looking at this list PCTFE has caught my eye, a quick search reveals that it's a badass fucking plastic in that it's resistent to most everything, radiation, electricity, fire, chemical corrosion. It has a high compression strength and low deformation under load (which would make it good for structural/skeletal systems) and can survive in temps up to 400 degrees F. Trouble is that it has been discontinued, but I suspect this is made up for by teflon, which has several of the chemical and heat resistance properties as PCTFE, but from what I'm reading, doesn't have the same strength properties.

If PCTFE can be manufactured or a stockpile of it found (at least in the development stage) it could potentially be one of the key ingredients in suit construction.

Add in some special coatings or other cool polymers/alloys and it would only be a matter of fitting it together.

>>686039

Quick update, some companies do still manufacture/still have reserves of PCTFE, however, a 1x12x12 sheet of the stuff would cost $3k, and weighs 4x as much as the UHMWPE of the same size.

However that's for a sheet of the stuff, a 1in x 6ft rod of it would be ~$1200, which is a little bit better and more useful for structural stuff, but still pricey as fuck (but then again, why spare any cost when building an unstoppable war machine :^)

If there are any rich anons who would like to fund the power armor project or the "PAP" project, we can promise that your first born child will be an armored beast, we just need monies to do it :)

>>629672

Your pic is a bit misleading as it is only 2d and doesn't account for many things, such as wheels+axels, engines, armaments, etc. If you were to cut plates from any armored vehicles and form it to a man, you would still have material left over as there isn't any air space being wasted inside the protective unit.

On top of all that, a vehicle and infantry have two very different roles, those roles primarily being that vehicles gotta go fast/far, and that infantry need to kill other infantry and/or garrison an area, which a suit of power armor would help with as he would be less prone to dying. You gonna clear a house or stand a post in your MRAP pal?

>>629837

>>626804

>The cost of fielding AP ammo vs the cost of armor would make it essentially useless

>So? Go up to 12.7mm, it's not like infantry can't carry it.

This is counter to most modern doctrines of overwhelming firepower, overwhelming as in a swarm of bullets. If soldiers actually had to be marksmen and hit their target instead of mag dumping at a bush, what would come of the world?

They MIGHT decide to include a marksman with a rifle even bigger than what they use now, but it would take a while as they would first need to manufacture additional weapons since these kinds of destructive rifles are purpose built and used for special ops/snipers more often than not. They would then also have to train their troops on it, which may include every pair of boots on the ground. On top of that, they wouldn't be able to carry as much ammo since it's several times heavier than their common small arms round. With it being such a heavy and destructive round, it's unlikely they will want to waste it on pot shots and some randoms running between cover. the closest stop gap they would have would be to have a jeep with a mounted 50. or a sniper carrying a 50. tail a unit, even then they would have to deploy these stopgaps to where they THINK the jugg would be.

That's a lot of trouble to go through to make up for the possibility of maybe running into them. Even at which point it would be advisable to simply run away. RPG's might help, but you'd better fucking hit your mark, because your only going to have a couple rounds at any given time, especially in combat. Still, at that point it would be the same issue with the rocket man as with the sniper, he wouldn't want to waste his limited munition for a chance of MAYBE hitting the guy.

All of that, on top of the fact that such a unit would be used in special scenarios, those most likely involving a protection detail or trying to undo a stalemate, either that or close quarters urban combat, which AT would be uncommon as they would only be expecting armored vehicles, which is what they would use the AT for anyways. Hitting a man sized target with a rifle is hard at 100m in combat, try using a rocket launcher while standing still and only getting one shot for that same target. Seems a bit unreasonable, same as shooting a man with a rocket at less than 50m-25m.

>>686049

You say that like the US govt hasn't blown more money on more useless shit. Hell, if you look at my above posts you may note that the suit doesn't even have to be fucking heavy, as with the development of polymers/alloys and various coatings along with other neat-o tech, the suit could easily be his weight or less, some of that shit weighs like 5lbs, for a 12x12 plate, thats ~10lbs to armor a body segment. Sure it won't be featherweight, but it at most it will double your resting weight, put that on a strong a shit guy has DENSE, not big, dense, muscles and he could easily carry his weight two times, add in an polymer skeleton that's even stronger than the armor itself and the problem of actually supporting this weight goes away, add in some motion assistance calipers to move it and he should have no problem getting around. Sure he won't be the flash on meth, but that's kind of a null point when you can take hits like the juggernaut and have shit to get you around fast anyways (jeeps, helicopters, etc)

Sure, the electrical muscle power multiplies may eventually cause his body degrade to the point of death, but keep in mind these men are not mean't to be eternal gods, but instead thick meatshields that take a long time to grind through, and in the event that he doesn't happen to get btfo, you can simply remove his body, repair the fucked up section of suit, and pass it on to the next test tube ubermensch.

Yeah, the men will take a long time to grow, but no longer than any basic infantry would, even if the supply isn't as steady. With genetic mods they could be grown in a fraction of the time, and if modified to have more powerful brains/higher iq's they could be taught more and sooner. This makes up for their lack of creation rate, although you would need to have a factory to make them regularly, but does the imperium not have chapters dedicated solely to their creation?

Of course they're going to be better in nearly every way than the common man, but they are still men . Regardless, men are not equal, despite what zerkosteinowitz says, this is clear in all things, the same as in wh40k, you have mutant serfs, and you have god-like men. The caste system would enable such a cooperation.

Even still if they didn't get along, it would merely be the next step in human evolution. You could even go so far as to genetically modify women to have bigger hips, wombs, and breasts to birth more supermen.

All of this would obviously cost much more in terms of material and sustenance, but the trade off is that you have much more capable and high quality humans who are better able to carry out their predetermined societal roles.

>inb4 quantity over quality

the imperium still made common use of guardsmen and regulars.

Why are you so afraid of giga-chad ultra men, anon?

>>686057

>>686049

As an addition to that and any other "what ifs", I'm going under the guise that money and ethics are irrelevant to the probability of this development. The ultimate development of this is to elevate humanity (not untermensch) to a state of ultimate being, and to ensure it's survival long into the future, and to be able to fight the inevitable battles that await in the far future.

lots of wh40k references, I wonder if there is any relevance between that universe and our reality?

>>686389

Hence why AI is considered heresy.

>>686419

What about trying to program PCTFE for use as a skeletal structure? Or something of similar strength?

Perhaps we could even have the bones engineered to be carbon based instead of calcium, or would denser calcium bones be stronger?