Detailed view of area within camera frame of CLAS_WW_UK_ACTIVE_T - Q1456, key part of LondonPicsWW.
https://youtu.be/CpRGKZH4ZKE
Checklist template for use by anons' documentation of the bulb positions on the XMASS GRILLE stall in righthand side of Q pic of WW thar featured Wilde Maus coaster ride in near background, Giant Observation Wheel in distant background, and Double Decker carousel in lefthand side of middle ground. The immediate area of this part of the theme park is the Power Tower Plaza and it occupies much of the camera frame of the Q pic CLAS_WW_UK_ACTIVE_T.png in Q 1456.
https://qalerts.pub/?n=1456
Also example of checklist in use, featuring the vidcap used as basis for the template.
And another example with the WW Q pic as basis. Note use of yellow triangle to represent the rooftop banner-type sign.
Yellow rectangle.
Tanks Bakes.
Was a bicycle parked against the posts at corner of The Corinthia Hotel? Northumberland Avenue and Whitehall Place.
A bike appeared right there on the sidewalk in each and every Q pic which included THAT spot outside the hotel.
Pic related.
Compare pic of woman who posed for selfie in Q1456 v pic of woman on front stoop in news-photo in Q1721.
For emphasis, compare pics, not woman.
Pic comparison.
(A) Q1456
Shot with wider angled lens, distorted, night with loads of ambient artificial light, possible filler flash from man's camphone, note his shadow on her shoulder/facial flank, cam vantage above typical head height but including lots of vertical ie coaster and sky above, subject of photo ambiguos – the Plaza backdrop. Posed for photo within photo. Note tickets in hand.
(B) Q1721
Shot in broad daylight, winter in Wash DC, zoomed, medium distance, pro photo snapper, candid pic not staged in obvios pose. Could've been staged but looks impromptu with subject unprepared, unaware.
For emphasis, Q1456 was photo within photo. The subject held tickets in pose for selfie in front of one of the main attractions of 2013 WW season. The Q pic could've been taken by friendly along for the ride/day. BUT cam position suggests possibility of mounted device either handheld by pedestrian or fixed on nearby structure.
My hunch is fixed to structure behind wooden towers with clear line of sight into Plaza. Hunch = speculation. Gatheribg ictorial evidence. Request for pics, vids, caps from towers and behind. Even revist prev sauces.
Significance? If fixed, AND friendly, then "knowingly", then friendly with security. Useful for dating pic, IDK, however, if Q Pic and selfie pic indicate tickets for Wilde Mouse rather than other rides, THEN, could be other pics taken by commercial camera on tracks by Wilde Mous attraction. Such pics are timed per car and offered for a fee. Not saved … unless … seewatEYEmeans, frens?
Now comparing woman.
Q1456 hairline obscured in man's shadow. General features make fair match, given conditions. Especially re little if any makeup?
Crooked when teeth not shown, not gummy smile, expression of ,,, what?
Pic here hintsm of frooked smile breakibg out?
Yeh, that was a pic that Q reposted. It compared crosswalk woman w news photo of LP however the emphasisnof anon's comparison was big handbag. Looked bit like quasi briefcase for office. Oversized for purse, IDK.
https://qanon.pub/data/media/12d57a5523bba938f1a82d5b20e8905327925ddad6674ef04c85885ae8c2bf64.jpeg
In reposted pic, was that a red bag? Colour scheme.
>The Embankment series shows Lisa Page and Peter Stzrok (FBI Counter-Intelligence) working to make sure Hillary Clinton is POTUS in 2016 Election.
Not confirmed that either or both outside USA kuch less in London. Pics very open to many directions.
Your speculations are plausible, by means other than presence of two particular indivuals within London pics. In a way that reduces significance of the place and time of the pics. Not necessarily a bad thing, natch, but also not necessary.
Can't ID the woman with just these pics coz too blurred. Wilde-Mous-produced pics and/or ticket purchases and/or travel expenses could do it and we have no access on our own. Need moar on whereabouts of LP or Fang to place one near the scene. At least out of USA.
The little we do have does not exclude LP in the WW pics. On other hand, eyes, cheeks, mouth and height make a fair Q match. Not firmly locked, still open.
Have noticed lots of doubles, vaguely look-alikes, on scenes of false flag events. Sometimes a hat or length,of hair or top or trousers is enough in blurry pics. But in WW vids, hardly any red touques, which miggt expect to be quite common during Chridtmas time at Chtistmas themed park.
>Anon, how did you get that enhanced WW couple pic? I could not comment on it before knowing whether it is a simple enhancement or a blend of another picture to arrive at that image.
Fren, got some tools at hand. That pic is by-product from basic enlargement for other purposes. Of course, when in doubt, return to the original. General features and shadow are alike in both versions. View of hairline has been partially obscured by man's shadow.
In 2013, LP was mother of very young children. Also was very junior at DOJ. To climb she'd need to be loyal and helpful to someone also climbing.
Maybe dig her career moves and prepare timeline for any indication of London connexion. That might place her at crosswalk or at WW. If you find she was somewhere else, that would be useful. Process of elimination.
Did she travel to London for other reasons, including personal vacations, education, running marathons (spring), watching Wimbledon (summer), and so forth.
>>15703750 Notable documentary PB
Special Escort group, documentary recorded 2000 as well as 2013; released 2014 and postee 2015.
>>15707788 all PB #43
>>15769458 Victoria Street re Black Box pic.
>>15769530 crossing Lambeth Bridge
>>15769724 2013 footage of Embankment
>>15769775 error in date in documentary
>>15769883 BMW v Honda motorbikes
>>15779927 PB #43
22 DEC 2013 Taken like riverwall adboard pic.
Tattershall Castle pic, Tatt = Q match.
Shows BB shroud Q match.
Hispaniola Q match
>>15780101 PB #43
>>15780422 PB #43
Previously had determined that CH2 was not taken after 2 MAR 2014 which is the date that a stock photo was taken and which showed the 1st Aid sign. This moves the bookend. CH2 could not have been taken after 27 JAN 2014.
>>15780717 PB #43
22 DEC 2013 Taken.
Bike parked at Corinthia Hotel, Q match.
>>15780437 PB #43
TATT pic 25 JAN 2014 Taken.
>>15780534 PB #43
Red Bus scene pic w/o Christmas lights.
22 JAN 2014 Taken.
Q pic was not taken after 22 JAN 2014.
>>15780602 PB #43
Previous evidence of a police viewing deck present 1 JAN 2014 (within area captured in Red Bus pic) can now be compared with the lack of such a deck in position on 22 JAN 2014.
>>15780632 PB #43
Piccadilly Circus scene pics
4 DEC 2013 and 22 DEC 2013 Taken.
Intact snow globe.
>>15780757 PB #43
Riverwall adboard, Q match.
22 DEC 2013 Taken.
>>15780935 PB #43
CH corner w parked bike, NOT Q Match due to details near bike. Prolly means that the Q pics were not taken on 22 DEC 2013 but that date can not be ruled out given the temporary nature of these markers which are easily moveable.
Note: lots of interdasting pictorial evidence supports late DEC 2013 for Emk and Piccadilly pics.
>>15857085 PB #43
>>15852246 revisiting Ww pics.
As the digs progressed, the werk moved from the 2015/2016 assumption and into narrowing the dating of each pic. Despite all the sauces available online and elsewhere, the WW pics have not been narrowed more tightly than the basic open and close dates of the theme park.
Maybe an Anon will revisit the pictorial evidence and make progress we haven't had on WW for quite some time now.
>>15855158 PB #43
What I hate about that WW pics is that there is not so much as a single burned out light bulb in the decorations that might have helped to narrow down the date. One would expect everything perfect at the beginning but maybe some burned out bulbs as the weeks progress? Needle in a haystack.
>>15857085 PB #43
There were burned out bulbs or malfunctining lights on the Wilde Mause. These distinguished 2012/2013 from 2013/2014. Those two years were arguably the closest.
Another subtle detail was the overhead guide wire that appeared in the 2012/2013 season but not in 2013/2014 and is a key differentiator.
>>15857244 PB #43
Look closely at the Q pic of Wilde Maus. Search for at least one car on the tracks. I could find none. This is unusual, I think, based on loads of vids and images from the theme park at all hours of the day through out the weeks open.
Lack of kiddies = clue to time of day. Likewise the lack of a heavy crowd in the Plaza.
>>15868004 PB #43
Parts of the wooden tower which housed a snack stand; it was one of two towers that appeared in that position in the Plaza and were first intoduced in 2013/2014. In later seasons, these looked different and appeared in diff positions and locations. So 2013/2014 setip was unique. Greatly useful marker.
The steeply sloped roof of Apres Bar was in that position next to the coaster ride at the Plaza for just that one season, winter 2013/2014.
>>15868107 PB #43
The popularity of Wilde Maus stands in contrast with the paucity of partakers qued-up in this particular pair of WW pics.
>>15869808, >>15869836, >>15869940 PB #43
Dailed lighting on various rides.
>>15870425 PB #43
The lights on Xmas Grille stall. Well spotted.
Process of elimination. Dig his schedule and appearances. Buttress the theory. Add facts.
Or go for positive evidence he was in London. Either way, fill in the blanks.
Examples.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Eric_Swalwell_in_2013
https://swalwell.house.gov/media-center/in-the-news?page=9
Swalwell in California in NOV 2013.
https://swalwell.house.gov/media-center/in-the-news/sandia-kicks-habitat-humanity-project-labs-volunteers-rebuild-house
Swalwell in California on 15 DEC 20139
https://swalwell.house.gov/media-center/in-the-news/congressman-helps-locals-buying-christmas-trees
Swalwell, at East Bay Chinese Student Association event, 9 Feb 2013.
https://twitter.com/ericswalwell/status/300488618693234688
Request that each be tied directly to:
sauce link,
title of sauce,
date posted by sauce,
date taken if provided by sauce,
date taken if figured by Anon and descriptioj of how date was deduced.
Basic housekeeping needed coz getting close to result. Prolly gonna use blunt force to scrounge moar evidence. That could mean returning to these jigsaw puzzles after someetime. Let's tidy ship now to avoid confusiond laters.
Here is scratch for Q pic. Added position over left leg which appeared dim, maybe unli or failing bulb/s.
Summary to-date in dig.
Bulb pattern on Xmas Grille roof, re XM.
Consistencies?
a) 8 leftmost positions as follows,
Lit = 1, 2, 4, 6, 8
Unlit = 3, 5, 7
Lit-lit, unlit-lit, unlit-lit, unlit-lit
b) 14 middle positions as follows,
Lit = 15, 18, 20 to 27
Unlit = 16, 17, 19
Lit-unlit-unlit, lit-unlit, lit x 8
Consistencies when in shot/discernible?
c) 5 rightmost positions as follows,
Lit = 29 to 32
Unlit = 28
Unlit, lit x 4
Inconsistencies or changes across dates captured?
d) 9 lit mostly, 1 exception, 15-DEC-2013-T
e) 11 unlit mostly, except 19-DEC-2013-T
and Q pic
f) 14 lit mostly, except 24-NOV-2013-T
and 25-NOV-2013-T
Banner sign bulbs mostly lit but a few did appear unlit at times.
1) Bottom left = unlit 5 of 6 instances
Q pic?
2) Left = unlit 3 of 3
Q pic?
3) Top = 2 of 6
4) Right = 1 of 6
Showed 2 unlit positions in one indtance
17-DEC-2013-T
Gud Q Matches?
Two candidates at this moment in the dig.
15-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit bottom
19-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit left
Just a summary and remains open for moar observs and evidence. Q pic now looking like close to mid-DEC-2012.
Are you surprised that the pixels showed that much? More than we know.
>Q pic now looking like close to mid-DEC-2012.
Correction.
2013
Q pic now looking like close to mid-DEC-2013.
NOT 2012.
mid-DEC-2013.
Will repost.
Summary to-date in dig. [CORRECTED]
Bulb pattern on Xmas Grille roof, re XM.
Consistencies?
a) 8 leftmost positions as follows,
Lit = 1, 2, 4, 6, 8
Unlit = 3, 5, 7
Lit-lit, unlit-lit, unlit-lit, unlit-lit
b) 14 middle positions as follows,
Lit = 15, 18, 20 to 27
Unlit = 16, 17, 19
Lit-unlit-unlit, lit-unlit, lit x 8
Consistencies when in shot/discernible?
c) 5 rightmost positions as follows,
Lit = 29 to 32
Unlit = 28
Unlit, lit x 4
Inconsistencies or changes across dates captured?
d) 9 lit mostly, 1 exception, 15-DEC-2013-T
e) 11 unlit mostly, except 19-DEC-2013-T
and Q pic
f) 14 lit mostly, except 24-NOV-2013-T
and 25-NOV-2013-T
Banner sign bulbs mostly lit but a few did appear unlit at times.
1) Bottom left = unlit 5 of 6 instances
Q pic?
2) Left = unlit 3 of 3
Q pic?
3) Top = 2 of 6
4) Right = 1 of 6
Showed 2 unlit positions in one indtance
17-DEC-2013-T
Gud Q Matches?
Two candidates at this moment in the dig.
15-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit bottom
19-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit left
Just a summary and remains open for moar observs and evidence. Q pic now looking like close to mid-DEC-2013.
Are you surprised that the XM's pixels showed that much? More have than we knew/know.
>e) 11 unlit mostly, except 19-DEC-2013-T
> and Q pic
THIS may be decisive distinguisher.
Still to be resolved = need moar.
1) Bottom left = unlit 5 of 6 instances
Q pic?
2) Left = unlit 3 of 3
Q pic?
>Gud Q Matches?
>Two candidates at this moment in the dig.
>15-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit bottom
>19-DEC-2013-T if Q pic banner unlit left
Bulb position #9 was lit in all except
15-DEC-2013-T, but lit again 17-DEC-2013-T.
UNLIT in Q pic.
The banner sign may be decisive.
Did Q pic capture ANY unlit bulbs on banner?
If not, then, could be AFTER 19-DEC-2013-T.
Q pic
https://qanon.pub/index2.html#1456
https://qanon.pub/data/media/e21a467394bcafdd201afeeff0b20a7121c954a79a21e143304cdbe7d2b001c8.png
https://qagg.news/?q=%23%231456
https://qagg.news/images/e21a467394bcafdd201afeeff0b20a7121c954a79a21e143304cdbe7d2b001c8.png
Q pic showed 3 of 5 lightbulb positions along slope of rooftop on cabdy floss stand located behind direction tree in middle backround in Q camera frame.
This stand is adorned with small polar bear sitting on sloped roof.
All 3 bulbs are lit.
In cap from vid posted 30-NOV-2013-P, the 3rd position is unlit.
Vid taken 15-DEC-2019-T showed 3rd position lit and 5th unlit.
None of the bulb positions are lit on that part of the roofbof candyfloss kiosk, in vid of 11-DEC-2013-P. Lit on other parts of roof.
15-DEC-2013-P
Leaving it to anons to figure how many bulb positions are lit on near roof vs area behind. If near, then 3rd is lit. If behind then maybe none are lit on near part. Interdasting.
Am knackeree. Please carry on wo me.
Cheerio.
26-NOV-2013-P
Candyfloss Kiosk roof lights.
Bulb position 3 in Q pic was unlit, as was in this vid too. Other 4/5 positions lit on that part of roof.
So far, in sum, Candyfloss Kiosk showed 3rd bulb was unlit at times in late NOV and early DEC 2013, but was lit during days just before and on 15-DEC-2013. And as for later, we don't yet know.
Kinda matches up with XM's lights? Contradictions in evidence?
>>15968864 UK Bread
>>15965108 UK Bread
>>131926 QResearch Bunker
>>131856 QResearch Bunker
Caution: enhancements for purpse A can generate distortions for purpose B, C, or purpose-yet-unforeseen.
Ex. See pic. Hyperdigital Age (think AI) makes distortions easier to a) generate inadvertently, b) distribute, b) exploit. Can be done but should it be done? If done, be transparent and advise caution. When in doubt or when accuracy is essential to purpose, return to the original. Think organic.
Principle: Do not introduce an unnecessary risk to the accomplishment of the mission. Only risks that enable mission success without unnecessarily jeopardizing safety are acceptable, frens.
Copy?
WWG1WGA
To my eye, banner sign bulbs were fully lit in Q pic.
Shape of sign, aspects which give its appearande as a cloth or scroll-type 'banner', creare impression thst the edges were 'rolled'.
This is the desired effect and unlit bulbs can defeat that illusion. Can be moar likely noticed because somewhat jolting even to nonautistic passerby. Additional incentive to maintain. So, yes, that makes this banner sign a gud target for hunting changes - failed or failing bulbs and replacements - and sequencing sauces against Q pic.
And we are biased, unavoidably, toward seeing useful markers.
Remember this dig's past succes came from some random observs that withstood intense scrutiny. Always, sceptism advised as the counter balance to magic eye.
Moar evidence for failed bulbs on banner at THAT side? Before and after the best example of unlit spot? This is a tall order. Banner's bulbs are packed closely.
Garry's hi-res close and unobstructed shots very gud as templste. And not so much for template for night shots like Q pic. Need daylight pics, night pics, twilight pics (which may prove best) for our comparisons.
Back to happy hunting.
>That woman is Asian.
Kek. Howzabout, of Persian descent? A la LP …
Looking closely at the Q pic of boots on the ground, and having thots of 'foot soldiers' come to mind, my magic eye did wander to discern that the lady does wear a dark scarf about the backtop of her asian/persian/dainty noggin.
And the oversized bag seemed an odd thing to LUG to pickpocket paradise. Tower Plaza was top draw, despite surveillance. Eyes looking upward "like a lot", to say it like DJT.
Enhanced for bag.
Maybe you meant, from Chi-na, or Hong Kong? What are shovels for?
Re the other non-London London pics.
Have you dug into Fang's whereabouts winter 2013/2014? Or S?
Breads ago, dug The Cardinal's known whereabouts. Not London during the London pics interval. Coulda ben there 'unknown', possibility but no evidence to support plausibility. Yet?
Meanwhile, banner revisited,
11-DEC-2013-P
>if we but look
That is my point, fren. I looked at the Q pic and to my eye the pixels depict this sign as fully lit.
Facts support this discernment. As does context capturee in both 2012/2013 and 2013/2014. (For instance, 2012 sign was simply concaved vs 2013 sign's greater complexity.) The faint weakness is not necessarily unlit bulb/s but plausibly seen because part of the design. The banner design used closely packed bulbs on highly reflective surface to create the illusion of a banner especially from distance. The design compensates for a single unlit bulb here or there. Even unlit, these bulbs are very shiny. Still, due to type of sign, it comes with additional incentive for diligent upkeep. So capturing actual bulb failure from afar would have rare. If evidence confirmed such a capture, then, fantastic. It is a tall order that can be achieved with evidence IF it exists. The Q pic on its own doesn't show enough to make of the percieved weakness/s bulb/s that are unlit.
Meaning, there were gaps, not occupied by bulbs, on the parts of the sign's edges where the illusion of a rolled ribbon-type scroll was in effect. Please seevattached pics which, as mentioned earlier, provide excellent basis for a template of bulb positions AND gaps.
In the markups, haven't highlighted the vertical gaps that form the reflective surface for the scroll or ribbon illusion of a banner. The 2D ine drawing depicts general idea that was transplanted onto 3D sign with lights to augment.
Unlit bulbs in open sauced images, yes, captured so certainly did occur on that sign during both seasons. Visible in Q pic? Not necessarily.
Take care to look at original rather than enhanced versions that are by-products of modifications for sake of eaves.
Enhanced version re eaves. Mot a neutral effect. Distorted the banner shades.
This may be detected, also, on righthand side of the setback part of banner. Adjust for camera angle.
Challenge is to find an image from another 2013 sauce that clearly shows that position's unlit bulb/s and thus a Q match. For now, seems possible, yes, but alone the Q pic is not strong enough.
To be clear, the weakness/es described might be due to unlit bulbs, but not necessary for Q match. That there is weakness/es could be so yes, due to design or even other lighting casting colour or shadow. IOW can still be matched with sauces, unlit bulbsnor no.
In effect, this broadens the prospect of finding useful sauces. Banner sign might play role of supporting actor rather than star - see eaves. Likewise candyfloss kiosk, supporting role.
>at least ONE inoperative, non-functioning, broken light socket that year on the lower part of the banner beneath the letter S of XMAS GRILL
Yes, fren, that was captured in sauced pic because it stuck out like a missing tooth in a Benny Hill smile. Not so much in Q pic.
Same for lefthand side.
As with the ticket kiosk of Red Bus dig, there isn't enough shown to be sure. But process of elimination helps narrow the possibilities.
>Q pic could still easily precede the 15DEC vid as well
15-DEC-2013-T is like the lone riverwall adboard pic sauced 22-DEC-2013-T.
It serve as an essential stake in the ground due to fair match re eaves. Kiosk lighting lends a helping hand coz in same sauced vid. Banner holds same potential.
Am looking atnother areas in Q pic. That transparent highlight under the tower's eaves, with the lit bulb, has drawn my attention despite paucity of gud direct sauced images. Puzzling sight not apparent on the other corners of either of the two wooden towers. There were 8 cornersbto compare.
Best spec I conjured is that an improvised curtain of some type was hung there as shield against blowing rain, earlier that day. Some resenblance to plastic sheet, for example. Saw clear plastic 'draped' to protect plush toys nearby.
>Anons can do as they wish.
Of course.
To be fair, the use of the charts might also communicate uncertainties in team's dig.
Example >>15904961
Recall Q 1460
https://qanon.pub/index2.html#1460
Q 1461
https://qanon.pub/index2.html#1461
Like you may be on this, I've been certain of my notions re other Q posts, including London pics. Mine is a hard head. At times impermeable, too. Humbled by harder evidence; humbled by insipid evidence that seeps in or, during least expected times, gushes in like a Japanese tsunami.
Hoping for a decisive find re banner. Ready to help, too.
In the pic you wrote, wrong. What's wrong? The arrows pointing to gaps unoccupied or the black circles over unlit bulbs?
There are both gaps and unlit bulbs in those pics, yes?
Sequencing the available images is important, natch, but that does not place the Q pic in that sequence, yet.
Suppose the banner was fully lit in Q pic. Must it have been taken before, say, 19-DEC-2013 and not later? The season ran to early JAN and the dig has only just begun for evidence. We have the 2nd half of the season to go yet.
If not as bright as the rest, and not meeting criteria for weakness in illumination, would you then have a 3rd category between lit and unlit but not weak?
The circled bulbs were near the areas noted as gaps, which also provided examples of potentially percieved weakness, esp from, long range like the night Q pic in question. Both pics were taken close range in daylight. Useful as template.
Speculating about maintenance is useful, as you have shown. And, as you suggest, dating by the banner may become increasingly difficult with increased lit/unlit/weakness data points. But the evidence will be assessed against reported, or figured, taken dates and posted/published dates. More data points, or no more, will just be in the cards we are dealt.
If a hypothesis deserves to be set aside, ie dating this Q pic by the banner sign, or by another marker, then so be it. Some ideas don't get results while others do. The digs have crushed all manner of excellent ideas from each digger here.
Not keen to psychoanalyse Q. But your point is very gud. That sure feels like a strong hint.
What event occurs in Dec (London)?
Think Hyde Park.
Think prev pic [2] people.
Provides Timeframe.
For emphasis, Timeframe.
Early JAN was clearly within the timing of the event held in Hyde Park in the Q pics. As was NOV which produced four of the sauces we have already relied upon, including stuff gud enough to use as template for banner sign. All grist for the mill. More days in WW season than d as days represented in our current stash of images NOV-DEC-JAN.
It is not my hypothetical timeline. This is the Timeframe provided.
See pic from sauce taken 15-DEC-2013. Not fully lit. Maybe you intended diff example, like a yet found sauce withh fully lit banner?
For a fair Q match, do not need to a find a verifiably fully lit banner, no imperfect bulbs, just something that looks like was fully lit as captured from distance, or in night darkness, or in dimly lit twighlight. The Q pic appears to show a banner sign that could be fully lit, even with potential weaknesses near gaps or near weakly lit bulbs.
This criteria broadens the possibility of finding fair Q match/es to compare.
>the day the Q pic was taken- the day they fixed all the burned out lights on the banner and the eaves.
The sarcasm is off target. Not necessary to match based on a theory. Just match the Q pic and use gud ideas about repairs to guide the digging. In sauces we have mismatches. And gud hints at bulb failings and replacements. All gud solid finds.
>What day was that?
Kek, the day/s that produced fair Q match, by whatever circumstances.
Replaced bulbs may be in such pic/s; there may be weaknesses, as you might percieve, where there were gaps, failing bulbs, unlit bulbs, missing bulbs, shadows and other coloured lighting that created the perception of weaknesses.
To my eye the resolution and detail is lacking in the Q pic to insist on unlit bulbs on the banner. Nor to insist on perfect lighting. Much less to insist on one and not the other. Just need a fair match.
Same vid. Different distance and different vantage.
Candyfloss stand lights displaced or not? Possible that line of bulbs seennon ridge in Q pic was rear right rather than front right?
Q pic showed view of short side of Candyfloss Kiosk. Also showed part of longer flank. To illustrate this, a semi-transparent symetrical triangle, approximately the shape of short side, has been superimposed over the Q pic.
Seems the bulbs on right side were along the back right ridge. Possibly one or two bulbs were partially captured on front ridge, too, but that view was somewhat obscured by the direction tree which stood between camera and kiosk.
This alters the usefulness of the kiosk bulbs for datibg/ sequencing sauce pics and the place of the Q pic in that mix. Meaning that to find a fair Q match, would need to show (a) 3 lit bulbs on lower half, at least, on rear ridge and/or (b) the lit 3rd bulb on front ridge.
(a) is that triplet of bulbs previously misidentified as being on front ridge in Q pic.
(b) is that partially viewable 3rd bulb on front ridge, as highlight in attatched pic where this bulb's position is encircled and compared with corresponding position of bulb in 3rd position on left front ridge.
Grain of salt: What appears to be a partially obscured lit bulb may be a bright reflection off a part of the structure of the direction tree. Scrutinize and use discernment. Is that white spot a li bulb on the kiodk ridge?
Interdasting snippet in that 15-DEC-2013-T vid which showed the Q WW scene from the other side of the wooden tower. Gud companion view of the Plaza, including peek behind direction tree. The view of "top of heads" also comparable. Side window on tower at serving area suggests primary light source for bright area near forward part of the awning in Q pic. That bright feature seemed transparent, like clear platic draping spotted under left front ridge of kiosk in Q pic. Seen also in sauced vid at same corner of that kiosk. Could be suggestive of damp weather.
View of corner of tower in psclonesteve indicates the Q camera was closer to the plane of the side of tower. Looks like Q camera and psyclonesteve's captured two corners/sides of same tower. No brellas in either view. Even if the weather was damp at times in psyclonesteve's vid, rain faded enough that some views showed neither rain nor brellas. On other hand, in Q pic some views of ground may have been damp. Bu haven't spotted clear and certain evidence of rain/dampness inside frames of the two WW Q pics. Mostly dry but London in winter, so …? For purpose of dating, matching markers in Q pic is the key. So no brellas is a useful marker coz none apparent in WW pics dropped by Q. Reminded me of POTUS leaving brella on stairs when he boarded Airforce One
Plastic draping under roof of kiosk, shielding plush toys and merchandise against inclement weather such as rain and/or rain? Possibly also under awning in Q pic.
Rain and/or wind.
Rained 15-DEC-2013-T part of the time in bid. Also cleared for spells in dark hours.
Flags were well blown during diff shots in the bid. Observed few, if any, cars on Wilde Mous track in Q WW pic. One possible reason,could be inclement weather. That coaster ride has been in used during rain, in psyclonesteve's vids of WW. Not sure about during windy weather. There usually are some weather restrictions. Apart from severe winds on day the theme park was pre-emptively closed, there may have geen situational closing/resumption of this coaster ride that season.
But in WW pic there doesn't appear to be much sign of high or gusting winds, even if there may been signs of damp weather. Ok, but maybe the paucity of cars on track suggests, instead an interuption's end, a pause coming to an end, as weather cleared. There are people on a ramp leading to the boarding area. Not a heavy line-up.
-
Night shot, no rain.
-
Possibly damp ground (but no brellas and no dripping wet people).
-
No cars on tracks (but at least 2 people approaching embarkment via ramp.
Pic related. Cropped Q pic.
Yes, odds are against that date being Q matched weatherwise. Heavy rains fell, strong winds blew, ground showed soaked in-between as well as during bouts of catz n digz.
15-DEC-2013-T pictorial evidence eliminates that date. This sauce remains useful for sequencing other sauces re markers like kiosk, banner, Xmas Grille eaves. Also for elevated views of Plaza which compared well with vantages on WM and Power Tower. Excellent sauce in general for WW before, during, after 2013/2014 season.
27-DEC-2013-P.
Very fine find, fren. This selfie stick vid shows how busy WM was with cars that night. Also weather. Had not viewed this one before.
See pic. This vid provided support for notion that the kiosk long flank was captured in Q pic. Note the angles of kiosk, tree, and tower. This configuration, as seen in this vid, is moar clear in reverse view, looking back toward camera of Q pic. Distinction between front and rear rigdes may still hold some promise. Noice find fersure.
>>15991608, >>16008725, >>16014149 .
Q Pic of WW scene (cropped/ enlarged) and caps from 15-DEC-2013-T and 27-DEC-2013-P used as rererences to make compilation.
The view between direction tree and kiosk suggests that a few of the flags on the tree served to obscure the Q Pic view of the lights on the front ridge.
To further the imagining those lights, as distinct from those on the rear ridge, here is an illustration. The clearly photo'd left front ridge has been copied and flipped to placehold for the obscured front right ridge. This has been aligned with the clapboard design of the hip roof surface as per configuration of the wooden towers, tree, kiosk, and deduced position of Q camera. This depends on informed guesstimates so please use with caution. The purpose is to aid seeing in mind's eye what have gud reason to think is there, uncaptured or partially captured, in Q pic.
On both sides of kiosk roof there sat a small scarfed polar bear, situated on second clapboard from top ridge. Size and "bearing" nominal, natch.
Along the front ridge, and possibly nearby on the roof over right flank, were white highlights in the night time Q pic. These may have been parts of lit bulb positions (ie 2nd and 3rd) or parts of the white bear, legs and feet maybe.
Compare with cropped Q view of kiosk.
Cropped Q pic, kiosk.
With polar bear seated on roof over wide flank, imagined as per known whereaboutz.
>>16014845, >>16014825, >>16014832
Composite of kiosk with view of right front ridge of hip roof and bear atop roof of right long flank.
-
Q pic showed 3 lit bulbs on rear right ridge, 1st, 2nd, 3rd positions, two moar uncaptured.
-
Q pic showed 1 or 2 lit bulbs, or parts of, on front right ridge, 3rd from bottom and possibly 2nd from bottom. Positions 1 and 4 almost certainly blocked from view by direction tree, lit or not.
-
The highlight that might be taken for a lit bulb in position 2 may have been part of polar bear, instead.
-
There were 4 bulb positions on right and 5 on left front ridges. All five on left can be seen clearly lit in Q pic.
-
At least the lower three bulb positions on rear right ridge were lit in Q pic. There were 5 positions. Upper two were not captured.
-
Moar bulb positions captured under the roof edge of kiosk on short and long sides. All captured positions looked to be lit.
-
Can see into through the kiosk to the area in front of WM ticket booth and entrance.
The scrutiny of kiosks will continue with observs of other Plaza images including 3 or 4 timely vids.
In "light" of above, revisiting
>>15967698 (none lit),
>>15967793 (lowest lit others uncaptured and highlights glinted off tree),
>>15968051 (looks like 3 of 4 lit bulb positions, aligned with clapboards a bit diff than in other sauces) (also lit bulb previiusly identified as lowest or first on right front ridge may have been on rear ridge instead),
>>15967296 (all 4 lit),
>>15967174 (3rd unlit and the array of four bulbs appeared slightly off ridge).
>>15982224 (2 lower bulbs lit on front right ridge, others uncaptured, array seems a bit off ridge),
>>15985070 (upper 3 bulbs captured, array off ridge, looks shorter than array on rear ridge, whichnhas 5 bulb spots) (also note ground space toward WM ticket booth and ramp entrance.
Sorry, Bakes, will bring dated list of these later, unless a fren beats me to it,in meantime.
^^^^^
Unfortunately this 2013/2014 vid was posted MAR 2014. Includes gud views of Plaza. Daylight. Looked like quieter day or time of day compared with Q Pic which itself didn't look very busy or crowded for WW.
https://youtu.be/IlqcAus70Vg
Gud view of tree distance from kiosk in direct context of the Plaza and WM.
Compare with couple of similar kiosks found at other spots in theme park that season.
3-JAN-2014-P
Vid captured 2 unlit or missing bulbs on Candy Floss kiosk, one on each front ridge as per vantage of Q camera in WW pic 2013/2014 season.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xE3fFS9WaJg
3-JAN-2014-P
Maybe a failing bulb on the front right ridge? It appeared unlit in one view and lit shortly after in same vid. Can't see an object blocking line of sight.
3-JAN-2014-P
Yup, both apparently unlit bulbs later appeared lit. Total of 9 lit bulbs across both front ridges. Two unlit positions lit moments later. Might interfere, droplets on camera lense? Haven't noticed smudges or droplets on different parts of camera frame. Intermittent?
3-JAN-2014-P
Well, maybe those two bulbs were blocked by the statuette polar bear figurines atop kiosk toof? Might depend on dimness of rainy night and vantage of camera as coaster ride changed directions and elevations?
If so, then, all bulb positions were accounted as lit in that vid'z recording date some drenched night just before park closed for the season. Note posted date.
There was a figurine sitting on each side of main roof … positioned just so ,,, and blocked the view of the front ridges.
Looks like all bulb positions were lit on kiosk roof that night. That would include bulb position 3 on right front ridge in Q pic as well as 3lower positions on rear right ridge ,,, and all 5 positions on front left ridge.
This vid's Kiosk bulbs make fair Q match. Late in season.
While this vid provides no Taken Date and lists a Posted Date months after the season ended, its date, MAR-2014-P, leaves open the entire 7 weeks or so of the 2013/2014 season.
During the recording, the weather looked overcast and crispy cold during daylight. In most of the scenes the crowds seemed medium to light. View of gift stalls providee gud example of medium anf Plaza gud example of light. Both are normally high traffic zones on busy dates of typical WW season, such as weekends and Christmas Week.
Business looked gud at Yeti ride and bumper cars both of which are aimed toward school kids. Bigger and moar aggressive and highly popular rides such as WM, looked lightly used. Christmas Coaster ran a lone and empty car, for example. Carousel Bar very light. But GOW had line. Santa Land not very busy and Reindeer ride at standstill. Over the Top spun w/o passengers.
Maybe due to weather?
Time of day, time of week, time of season?
10AM to 10PM each day.
Late NOV to Early JAN.
Colours of tree coverage looked moar autumn than winter, but also depended on that year's weather. In a few views, people looked well-bundled, including those pushing prams.
View of Candy Floss Kiosk showed unlit bulb position at 3rd from lower end of right front ridge, as previously observed. Looked like the 3rd was middle position of 5 total on that ridge at that time. Other sauces showed 4 positions with gap at or near top of hip roof.
As anons have suggested, this looks like an image/day early in season before a modification … Such as between days when no positions were lit and when all 4 were lit, or at least when 3rd was lit, as it appears it may have been in Q pic. Or this vid was after change that added 5th position? The rear ridge show 5 positions, all lit.
This vid doesn't seem to match Q, due to unlit position 3, but does match the lower 3 bulbs on rear ridge that were captured lit in Q pic.
Nother cap - that season's live musical entertainment included: The Vaccines. Kek.
Gud points. He did at least one recording in which he and another guy took turns recording and being recoded - and fam not in scenes.
16-DEC-2013-T included family. Still, possible that vids posted later included a mix of scenes from different Taken Dates, such as what may have been taken on 15th. At least some on-ride vids were just Psy and Buddy.
Typo correction'
15-DEC-2013-T.
Clarification: Discussion weighed recording of on-ride vids on same date as the vid which has Date Taken. Weighed against Date Posted of on-ride vid, 2-JAN-2013-P.
Posted Date = auto entered at time published on YT.
Note in titles, descriptions, comments can be entered in error AND can be edited.
POSTED different.
Manipulations of posted dates not available to typical user, but atypical user/s? IDK.
> may recommend looking up 2015?
Target = mismatch of POSTED v TAKEN.
Target = mismatch of CONTENT and assigned YEAR.
Ex1
Posted 2013/2014 season v editable Taken Date such as 2015/2016.
Ex2
Posted 2015/2016 season v editable Taken Date such as 2013/2014.
Ex3
Posted 2015/2016 v CONTENT of 2013/2014 season.
Ex4
Date Taken 2013/2014 v CONTENT of 2015/2016.
Other variations possible. Very big dig if persued. Where best to focus?
Let's review text of Q posts that include ref to distinguishing time guide v Timeframe or timeline, so on. Then add contrast "lighting" from two year delta.
2013 v 2015 = delta
Fren your observ could be grand chase of goose that is wild … Or mous that is wilde … Or a brilliant leap onto yuge target.
Excellent kerplunking. Shall we divide labour so as to get rapid test of this concept and to minimise risk of long steep slide?
https://www.youtube.com/user/LookGoodOnHoliday/search?query=2013
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjBM4Y-Jjn8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clcjL9l7tck
Repeat at diff link. Unlike Plaza scene of 2013/2014, Power Tower scene may be 2015, on first look.
Date Posted = 23-NOV-2013-P
= day of or one day after opening 2013/2814 season.
5 positions in bulb array on front right ridge on kiosk roof (as would be viewed from vantage of Q pic's camera).
3rd, or middle position, on that ridge was unlit.
4 other positions were lit.
5 lit bulbs on corresponding rear ridge.
Note relative angles of kiosk, direction tree, wooden tower AND Bavarian Village (electronis white sign at front entrance).
Odd that two young children left to stand alone in centre of Plaza on budy night. Maybe related/with camera operator, idk.
on busy night
Please check for errors and typos in following recap.
>poster submitted two identical vids: one posted 22NOV2013, the other posted the next day […] I think all 3 vids were taken on the same night.
Opening night = 22nd
= Date Taken regardless of Date Posted as per auto timestamp and despite year in title.
This cap/vid of Plaza esp kiosk bulbs is now firmly dated 22-DEC-2013-T, earliest night shot found so far.
Clarifies 5 bulb positions on front right ridge. Same on rear.
Clarifies 5 before reduced to 4 positions.
Clarifies 3rd front position unlit while all rear 5 lit.
Q pic showed same.
For emphasis, "showed" 5 lit in rear.
For empasis, "showed" lit 3rd from eaves position in front.
Q pic did not capture all bulb positions on front right ridge. Coulda been 4 and coulda been 3. But showed part of lit bulb at 3rd position.
See >>15991203,
Process of elimination. Looks like the NOV sauces are not Q matched re unlit #3. Looks like early DEC not Q matched re unlit #3.
See >>16006598, >>16008902
15-DEC-2013-T possible Q match re #3.
Maybe not re heavy rainfall that day and part of night.
See >>15991608, >>15995918, >>16007914, >>16014027
By time kiosk bulbs had been captured 27-DEC-2013-P, possible Q matches re #3.
See >>16015161.
By time scene captured in 3-JAN-2013-P, also possible Q matches re #3.
See>>16016417, >>16016505, >>16016524
>Q pic did not capture all bulb positions on front right ridge. Coulda been 4 and coulda been 3. But showed part of lit bulb at 3rd position.
Coulda been an array of 5 or an array of 4 bulb positions on right front ridge in Q pic. But only #3 was shown, partially, and it was lit.
Seen in mind's eye, >>16015017, >>16014998, >>16014825, ( >>>>15968051 ),
>15982224, >>16014832
Ah, yes, adult supervision, on mobile phone, waiting in area common for meet-ups AND for watching friends riding Power Tower.
Working on a vid to illustrate the point that Q pic showed position #3 (my nickname for bulb position on front right ridge, 3rd position from lower corner of roofline) only partially, and it was lit.
And to show that this position was aligned with 3rd clapboards around the hip roof and thus #3 was aligned also with 3rd bulb position on each of the other ridges.
And to show that #3 was part of an array of bulbs, on that particular ridge, that was comprised of 5 positions early in the 2013/2014 WW season; this arrangement later became an array comprised of 4 bulb positions with #3 continuing to hold same position re 3rd clapboard.
And to suggest that Q pic captured a lit bulb at #3 rather than missing or unlit bulb.
In some sauces #3 appeared occupied by lit bulb, in others unlit or empty. Likewise the 5th or topmost position on this ridge showed with lit bulb or missing bulb or as an actual gap where that array had become shorter.
Upshot is that Q pic's #3 is same bulb position captured in sauces that showed that ridge with bulbs in place with either 5 positions or with 4 positions, lit, unlit, failing, or missing.
For a fair Q match on #3, the position will be lit, IF discernment of Q pic = #3 occupied by lit bulb that was partly obscured by sign in between it and the camera.
This means that kiosk lights are gud marker for narrowing time interval, but not as clear cut as would be neededbto be a bit of decisive evidence, I think. It might be supportive of other evidence where the comparisons do not contradict.
Yes, that is good idea. Illustrste/ track process of elimination. Also can show uncertainties which, as evidence is gathered, may become less uncertain.
Basic goal is to weigh what we have, ie what we know we know, on the whole, including the holes, ie what we know we do not know, because we likely have more than we know.
For emphasis: This vid provided best reverse on-the-ground view, so far, of the Plaza area in which the two Q pics depicted a WW scene on a night during 2013/2014 season.
Each vidcap from that (30 seconds) vid snippet is a keeper. An excellent find.
Starts at mark 5:43
Ends 6:13
Done in [30]
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=clcjL9l7tck&list=PLGxV3FL278JbwF-LUix5DpJxsIsePws9n&index=2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clcjL9l7tck
Kek, habbenings live in UK Bread.
-
Does this Q pic show view of Xmas Grill eaves?
-
Shadows. Items a, b, c. Compare darkness to lightness. Compare length and angle/ trajectory. Faint v definite? Source of light and casted shadows?
-
Estimate distances?
>ground squares like dominos. [: :][: :]
These were intoduced there that season.
Hence the odd composition with boots on the ground. "Draws" attention both to and away. Unit of measure.
The shadows. Woman's at tree sign, man's, handbag lady's? Faint? Length? Source of light? How can a shadow be "neutralized"? Camoflauged shadows.
https://www.askaprepper.com/camouflage-concealment-art-staying-hidden/
For many wild animals, staying invisible is the key to survival.
Prey animals don’t want to attract the attention of predators; predators want to be able to sneak up on their prey without being seen.
https://productpictips.com/16-tips-to-eliminate-shadows-in-product-photography/
Armies teach that camouflage and concealment are different, but related, skills. Concealment is making yourself harder to see; camouflage is changing something’s appearance so it’s harder to notice.
Camouflage doesn’t need to involve making whatever you’re camouflaging look like something else; as long as it doesn’t look like what it actually is that’s good enough.
The human eye is naturally drawn to anything that looks out of place. It’s also drawn to anything that looks familiar.
If you can keep yourself concealed you’re at much lower risk of being attacked; you control your contact with other people – because they don’t know you’re there.
https://stipsniper.com/2019/10/03/the-7-ss-of-camouflage/
No matter how good the camouflage, you can’t hide that big dark shape of a shadow.
Try to become familiar with all this info to help you stay hidden in the field. The suit alone won’t do it, it’s all about mastering the finer details, especially how you the sniper interact with the terrain. Learn to be part of it.
Four Plaza pics. First w vid's original exposure to show bright lights to map to Q pic. Note tower of white lamps; and yellow light source. Second w over exposure to show ground mats. Third w vid's original exposure to show position of sign tree v kiosk on mats. Fourth over exposed for comparison.
(Or she is an undead, a vamp.)
Here is a panarama from vid. To show space between sign tree and Chip tower.
Maybe something like this?
Seeing same thing?
In panorama, CAM is approx in place the GU & GAL stood for selfie. I think that held tickets for the camera and he took pic on stick. He prolly vid their ride/s too.
Maybe LP was at sign tree in both WW pics.
CAM came very near the couple. So Q pic might be vidcap. Mobile. CAM had legs. Maybe one of individuals in other WW pic.
2 Q pics.
2 CAMs.
1 elevated.
1 on ground.
Plus CAMs carried by targets.
What if couple were NOT actual targets?
Props for pic-taking?
In both Q pics both Q cam AND couple's cans aimed toward potential subjects in background as well as each other?
Watching you watching him watching me?
Pic in pic.
Panorama sauce's cam had legs, natch, which stood about the same spot where GUY & GAL stood during the WW pic that was taken by Q cam betwixt towers, slightly back toward rear side of Doughnut tower. IOW the panorama captured approx the view the couple had as they stood in same place.
Easy to imagine their view, unobstructed, of sign tree area. AND the queing area in front of Chip tower, as per the Q pic featuring Wilde Mous.
Having viewed many open sources, get sickening feeling that WW has served as hunting grounds of human traffickers. A diff theme for theme park. Predators and prey. Cams catalogue. Crime scene/s.
Progress being made on this dig. Few moar vids in pipe.
This is an excellent sauce and a fine find.
Can see that lower bulb is present and lit. Daylight pic seems too uncertain on other positions. Darker pic seems uncertain on 2nd from lower bulb position and uncertain on uppermost position which would be 4th and/or 5th positions.
Darker pic shows light at middle position, I think. This is the position, or is very near the position that seems lit in Q pic. IF that position in this sauce fairly resembles the same in Q pic, then, actual bulb lit or reflecting or whatnot, then, fair match, I think.
And that's the significance of #3 (as I've been calling that middle bulb position).
The other ridges? Of course, the other front ridge, as viewed in Q pic, was not captured in this sauce. So neutral for a Q match. The rear ridge clearly shows lit bulbs in the lower 3 positions, which were captured lit in Q pic. The other positions on that rear ridge were not captured in Q pic; and neither were the positions on the other rear ridge captured in Q pic. So those are also neutral whether lit or otherwise, but may prove useful in sequencing with other sauces.
Upshot is that two criteria met for fair Q match on kiosk. This sauce was taken no later than 24 DEC 2013 because posted on 25th and WW park was closed on 25th. Could have been taken earlier, but not later.
Now, to exercise sceptism or caution, let's reconsider what is discernible versus what may be clearly seen.
-
While Q pic does seem to show at least one partial bulb, perhaps obscured by sign and/or garlands, (perhaps lit, perhaps dimly lit, perhaps only reflective off another source of light), my eyes can not be certain of that. To quantify, call me 75% confident that I dicern a #3 match with Q on this piece of puzzle.
-
And while this vid captured at least 2 lit bulbs, it is less certain in my eyes that Q's #3 position is in same location on the ridge. Close? Yep. So close it resembles Q pic? Yep. But seems a little high. Almost could be 4th from the eaves, if capboard pattern is also reckoned. Good resemblance to that location in Q pic, yes. Call me 90% confident that I discern a Q match on this element.
So while not beyond doubt, overall and by preponderance of the available evidence this sauce is a Q match.
This kiosk feature, as a marker of time, is corroborative. Like the Xmas Grill eaves lights, the kiosk ridge lights are fairly distinctive in Q pic and have been captured with differenfed in various sauces. Q matches have been hard to come by. This is also the case with the banner sign above Xmas Grill; and with the additional difficulty of discerning the state of that feature as captured in the Q pic. If these 3 markers align on a given date, or within a set of bookends, then, we may have narrowed the interval for the WW pics to something less than the 7 weeks the seasonal attraction was open.
>https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xe9y0L1FCh0
How to describe the weather signs in this vid?
-
Recording showed morn, afternoon, evening, dark of night. So consider signs across the twelve hours open, 10AM to 10PM.
-
Wet ground cover at least part of thevday.
-
Sky appeared changing from mostly overcast to mainly blue and open.
-
People's clothing also seemed to shift from bundled up to lighter then bundled again. But wouldn't say especially frigid. Looked a bit crisp but not harsh. Pleasant, really.
So, rain early morn, wet underfoot but opening sky above. Partially overcast day on the whole.
Observs?
>Can you say why you think they were there in the morning, Anon?
10AM Opening. Looked like meal for some before dark. Dusk before next meal time (indoors looked like). Dark later maybe 2-3 hrs on, toward night, if not as late as closing.
But this included assumptions about people in scenes. Such as maybe more showing up after rainy skies cleared. So, yeh could have spent much less time, just an afternoon and early evening on Christmas Eve day - or previous day. Not so many followed Christian trads in UK as did even couple decades prior to that recording. Crowded park, looked like.
After another look, found a detail that might change assessment of match-ups.
Start w Q pic and clarity of 3 bulb positions lit. These look evenly spaced on the clapboard pattern. On closer look the pattern is comprised of rows of shingles or simulation of. This roof pattern aligns with bulbs on Q pic's front left ridge; and on all hip ridges as seen in open sauces. Useful as reference to map bulb positions. Across seasons this type of kiosk was adorned with arrays of 5 bulbs on all 4 hip ridges and deviations can be spotted as rare. Also, this type of kiosk was typical dressed with another array along top central ridge. In Q pic, this long array appears but with empty sockets or unlit bulbs. This deviation is easy to miss in Q pic as it seems to have persisted across all open sauces. Noticeable when compared with other like kiosks in other locations. While I mention this here to provide fuller accounting and contest, the lack of lit bulb positions on central ridge is neutral for our purpoees, I think.
So each hip ridge = an array of 5 positions and each bulb position aligns on roof pattern of tiles or shingles. Q pic clearly shows full array on front left ridge and partial arrays are shown on right front and right rear ridges.
Continued …
In some sauces there are dim bulb positions on this kiosk. This effect could have been due to failing bulbs or other malfunctions. Could have been dead bulbs or unpowered arrays; the bulb might have reflected others sources of light.
In Q pic, the unlit sign tree threw its own reflections, too. Brightly painted and shiny surfaces through out the park have been captured doing this, natch. Happened in a few sauces that showed the sign tree and front ridge of this kiosk. So that effect was in the mix for matchups.
That aside, it seems Q pic might have captured 3 bulb positions on right front ridge. One on or close to central ridge? One at #3, mid-array, and one more at #1 position, on corner of eaves. I note these positions after re-viewing the open sauced pics am posting again.
Cont …
>One on or close to central ridge?
This could have been the topmost bulb position in the rear lett array. Likely was.
>one more at #1 position, on corner of eaves
This could have a bit too low for the lowest position in array on front right ridge. However, that arrays appeared to have moved, at least thrice, as captured in open sauces. This could account for an unusual appearance in Q pic. Then again, what is seen may well have been a reflection off tree sign.
So in my view, these two uncertain positions are neutral to reckoning Q match.
Such things might have been used to enclose the products against inclement weather. Dunno if stock would be removed after closing each day, but the sheet might have been used to "close shop".
In the case of that kiosk, in that plaza, the plastic draping might have been left unfurled during business hours to direct purchasers toward other 3 sides, idk. Do think weather protection is better explanation.
Yeh, potential marker.
In Q pic that plastic drape was captured on left side of kiosk, as you may know. Its effect visually resembled effect at tower's edge under awning.
… Continued
Here are two caps from 2013-DEC-25-P. First one just barely captured glint of 4 bulb positions on Q's right front ridge, reverse view. To my eye, the topmost position, the 5th, was empty or unlit. (See discussion here >>16058952 ). Neutral anyway.
Next cap. Used the array positions of previous cap (from same sauce) to reckon positions in this second cap. The purpose was to compare with rear ridge and to align along the horizontal tile or shingle pattern (previously misnamee as clapboard) which "bridges" the front and rear ridges. Second cap has been lightened and marked-up. Note feet and seat of bear figurine.
Please take a close looksee.
Continuee …
Line 4 of roof pattern was the roofcap on central ridge as good portion of shingles on long flank lay under it while a single large shingle covered corresponding smaller space atop hip roof's short flank.
See cap from 23-NOV-2013-P.
Continued …
Cap from 15-DEC-2013-T.
Note the five rows of shingles on long flank and four on short siee of hip roof. See bear's feet and seat.
In Q pic, barely see the bear. Just a hint of leg and seat. But does align with bulb position #3, I reckon.
Cont …
Continued …
Cap from 16-M AR-2013-P
This showed three ridges with terrific view of front hip roof for reckoning roof tile pattern alignment short-long sides. Also clear view of five bulb positions in each array.
The front right array is in disarray. Again, note figurine's feet and seat. Compare with Q pic.
Minor note, but given the relative height of the topmost bulbs in the arrays of left front and right rear ridges, can you see, im mind's eye, how the corresponding topmost bulb in the array on rear left ridge might have made its appearance in Q pic view of central ridge?
If yes, then, Q pic showed a bulb position of each of the four lit arrays. Another data point, perhaps, for assessing Q matches.
Do you see the potential for using 16-MSR-2013-P as means to figure line of sight through sign tree and onto front of kiosk? How might the ridge bulbs, and figurine, line-up in comparison with Q pic? Keep in mindelevation of camera. Compare with other open sauces that captured view of both kiosk and sign tree.
Happy hunting.
Cap from 30-NOV-2813-P.
#3 unlit.
Ok, now for that detail that may alter assessments of Q matches. In this cap there were five lit bulbs in the array on rear right ridge (as would be viewed from vantage of Q camera). Figure bulb positions on roof pattern.
Compare with 25-DEC-2013-P in which 3 bulbs eere lit on that ridge. The topmost position was unlit. Where was the other bulb position? Two of give were unlit.
Typo correction. Two of five were unlit.
Rear right ridge of Kiosk.
Cap from 15-DEC-2013-T.
Bulb positions appeared evenly dpaded.
11-DEC-2013-P.
17-DEC-2013-T.
26-NOV-2013-P.
04-DEC-2013-T.
Note disarray of array on front right ridge of kiosk in 04-DEC-2013-T.Difficult to discern bulb positions on rear right ridge.
Typo correction and for better clarity.
The 5th row of shingles, behind bear, were partly covered by roofcap on central ridge. On short sidemof roof, 4th row and what might be consideree location of 5th were covered by single large hip shaped shingle.
This means that the lower four rows in roof pattern corresponed over hip ridges to shorter side of hip roof. To figure the fifth row, note position of bear. Feet on third row, seat on fourth, and fifth behind bear's back. The pattern bridges the ridges. Can also use the roof signs that sit on first row on each side of four-sided roof.
In 24-DEF-2013- P, would you figure that unlit positions were
A) 4th and 5th?
B) 2nd and 5th?
C) other, fill-in-blank?
Am torn between A and B.
Significance? If A, then, matches Q. But not if B. Meaning this could be best match or just another instance of seemingly random malfunctioning bulbs.
If the latter, then, we will neee to rely on sequencing to narrow the time interval during which Q pic could have been taken. But if the former, answer A, then increases likelihood of Christmad week. Sequencing might corroborate assigned sauce dates, idk.
What do you see?
Drat, correction.
The sauce was 25-DEC-2013-Posted.
Since park was closed on Christmas Day, could not have been taken on 25th. Latest possible could have been 24th, but could have been taken earlier.
Taken between 15-DEC-2013-T and 25-DEC-2013-P? Not decided. Need moar.
Suppose that PsycloneSteve vids were recorded sameday, or on close days, and that 15-DEF-2013-T serves as a stake in the ground, if not as a firm bookend.
Well, on that day he captured 4 lit bulbs on front right ridge, which included #3. Okay. At least two additional sauces captured that also. Another sauce got it, too, buy posted in MAR 2014.
Based on previous sauces, that array of lights went from 4 of 5 lit positions (#3 unlit on opening day) to a disarrayed array (during first week of DEC) to a partially reset array of 4 lit bulbs (including #3 and not #5) by 15-DEC if not a bit earlier.
In a sauce posted 30-NOV-2013-P, #3 was unlit, so not Q match, AND all bulbs were lit on central ridge. That was the only sauce that showed litup top ridge I've seen so far. So not a Q match. This sauce also showed all 5 bulbs lit on rear right ridge which would match Q pic.
That fully lit array showed in NOV sauces and in DEC sauces until 25-DEC-2013-P. Then it showed only three lit.
To my eye the unlit bulb positions in that array on the right rear ridge (in that sauce) were the two up top. Comparison with the 30-NOV-2013-P and its litup central ridge, something interdasting popped out of 25-DEC-2013-P.
The topmost bulb position on the rear right ridge was about as high up the roof as the nearby rearmost bulb position on the central ridge. When lit, that topmost bulb on the rear right ridge could have been captured in Q pic very near the central ridge.
But only if the central ridge lights were unlit and not in the way of line of sight of Q camera position. But whatabout the rear left ridge's topmost bulb? Was it lit and would it show in Q pic too?
As it happens, the topmost position on that ridge was unlit in sauce taken on 15-DEC-2013-P. Just the lower four positions were lit then. See pic.
In 25-DEC-2013-P, the rear left ridge is hard to see, but no light is discernible near central ridge, just like in the attached pic taken at night from about 100 metres away on Wilde Mouse.
But is a bulb lit near the rear of central ridge in Q pic? Faintly, yes. I think so. This was either a bulb lit internally or lit by carrying reflection from nearby neighbouring bulb.
See pic in next post.
Significance?
The Q pic was closely matched to 25-DEC-2013-P but that sauce would fall short because of the lack of lit bulb at or very near the rear of central ridge.
So Q pic may have been taken BEFORE 25-DEC-2015-P. That would mean prior to that sauce being taken.
Or, if evidence of repair or replacement is found, taken AFTER a lit bulb reappeared in that spot. Process of elimination. Can we find such a sauce taken from between Christmas Day to season's end first week of JAN 2014?
^^^^^^
Reconsidered. The light in Q pic in rear spot near central ridge could not be in rear right array coz too far away. Uncertain could be in rear left array. Behind it there appears to be red light source from Wilde Mous so might be a bulb between that source and camera. Not self-illuminated, I think, but lit indirectly.
And so this marker is not related to rear arrays?
25-DEC-2013-P best Q match for kiosk ridge lights? Sorry for the quick misstep re bulbs near central ridge at rear right.
Thanks, Fren. Fresher eyes needed.
In this review of kiosk figured that eliminated more than 3 weeks by evidence from NOV alone; add 2 days closed in DEC; and likely tighten the NOT BEFORE bookend by first week or so in DEC. This cuts the interval by better than half from 7 to 3 weeks.
Add the Xmas Grill eaves and Banner and might eliminate JAN; which would narrow interval to around 2 weeks. Very promising.
Need moar late season images to firm-up the NOT AFTER bookend.
For the moment, think can safely narrow to at least NOT BEFORE 04-DEC-2013-T and stick with 6-JAN as NOT AFTER because season's end. Confident we can reason our way toward acnarrower interval with softer bookends, but holding out for solid direct rather than cicumstantial or speculative evidence. It is remarkable, I think, that we have three and possibly moar useful markers of signicance that may be corrobative on the whole. Generated out of deep scutiny and bloody mindedness. And encouraging discussions.
WWG1WGA
UK Anons and visitors might find this panorama useful as reference the wooden towers. This is generated from sauce recorded during 2014/2015 WW season. Also useful to establish that season does not match Q views of Plaza and its surrounds.
Panorama generated from sauce recorded 11-DEC-2013-P. Shows towers and likely vantage from which Q pics was taken.
This panorama is useful as WILDE MAUS reference that shows at least four markers that differentiate WW 2014/2015 season from Q pics. Generated from sauce recorded 23-NOV-2014-P.
Look for big XXL sign, colourful picket fence on entrance ramp, water fountain,and revamped area in front of ride's facade ie no stands like Xmas Grill.
And one moar panorama as ref to distinguish WW 2014/2015 from Q pics. Generated from sauce recorded 23-NOV-2014-P. Showing corner view of entrance yo Plaza and WM ride. Biggest marker is the replacement of APRES Bar with St Nicholis House. Also look for diff in front of WM facade … no Xmas Grille or other food stands.
Panorama generated from sauce recorded 25-DEC-2013-P.
>Moon recorded in the 11DEC vid looks more like a moon phase from 7 or 8 DEC.
>Now that is only 4-5 days after we saw a damaged right front array.
Got series of sauces which shows full 5 bulb array (23, 26, 30 NOV-2013-P) with #3 unlit.
Got 2 sauces (04-DEC-2013-T & 11-DEC-2013-P) and a 3rd sauce (MAR-2014-P) which show distinct changes to this array before appearance of its reset look in later sources.
Got 3 sauces all taken on 15-DEC-2013-T which show array on front right array was reset with topmost bulb position unlit or empty.
And then 25-DEC-2013-P added changes to rear right ridge with upper 2 bulb positions unlit or empty. This was recorded before Christmas Day when park was closed that day.
And got gaps between each of these series of images. And between Christmas and season's end on 5-JAN-2013.
Looks like the currently available evidence showed that kiosk matched Q pic from at least 15-DEC-2013 to 25-DEC-2013. The lunar evidence of 11-DEC-2013-P (and possibly of 15-DEC-2813-T also) bolstered that interval.
That interval remains open to extension backward to 09-DEC-2023 and forward to 5-JAN-2014.
The Q view of the central ridge showed a dimly lit position, perhaps at rearmost position, which may refine the interval.
And the Xmas Grill's banner and eaves supports this current interval and can refine it moar effectively.
Q pic hinted of clear plastic draped under the wooden tower's awning. That marker may alter the interval because its appearance in open sauces has not been found, yet.
While moar open sauce evidence is needed, it is amasing that within Q pics we have had moar than we knew, all along.
Showtime also displayed a clock. Erratic, natch.
Some sauces showed ride tickets. These have timestamps. Might be discernible. IDK. Could show time of day plus date issued/ dispensed.
Question: How quickly does night fall in London winter? Duration of dusk? Does it hasten in December? Fluctuating markedly?
Frens, the Q view of Xmas Grill is heavily pixelated. During the dig on eaves lights, enlargements and enhancements were introduced for various purposes. These can and did also introduce distortions and artifacts. Sometimes neutral. Sometimes not.
When in doubt return to original. When certain that a detail is significant, revisit original.
Here are infographics that begin the documentation of the Xmas Grill lights during WW 2013/2014.
Please examine original for comparison with other versions of this Q Pic.
Yup, the 19-DEC-2013-P vlogger captured an unambiguously unlit spot on banner sign. Looks different from original Q pic.
^^^^^^^^^
Will plod through this because my use of pics, caps, and vids and enlargements and enlargements may have created misunderstandings. My apologies.
>compare them, bulb by bulb
Can you see bulb by bulb in original Q pic's banner? For me, have not found anywhere close to that level of detail in that heavily pixelated corner of the original Q pic.
Believe me, wish the Xmas Grill banner sign had been at least as well captured as tge kiosk bulbs. Even at that, #3 is very hard to distinguish. Other sauces helped map out the relevant objects that were in the original. Still, not 100% certain of #3.
The Xmas Grill eaves showed a morse code type pattern that could be discerned coarsely. Other sauces were far more clear. The bulbs were well spaced and that aided comparison of clusters by estimated lengths of clusters. Do not see that in the scrutiny of the banner sign. The raw data is more coarse there than either eaves or kiosk.
You may be correct to intuitively read into it exactly what you point out is obvious in 19-DEC-2013-P.
I do not see the bulbs in the banner sign, just bright "lines" which were understood to be closely mounted bulbs even w/o ref to other sauces (which have confirmed the morse pattern). The Q pic is the touchstone, not the references. The modus operandi: Always return to the original when in doubt; and moreso when certain a detail is significant.
Frankly, I do not see unlit gaps in the Q pic pixels that I can see clearly in the diff res and diff angle and diff distance captured in original frame in this vid.
Someone has suggested an object may have been in the line of sight. I don't see that in the original Q pic. But it is an open possibility.
Another suggested faintness, dimness, weakness and so thought thst could indicate a failing bulb or a bulb reflecting light off another source such as nearby shiny surface or close neighbouring lit bulbs. Possible, yes, an open possibility.
To some extent these open possibilities depend on assuming the conclusion and finding it where it is needed. That is the way of potentially big insights. But even that will come under scrutiny in pursuit of greater certainty in facts.
Open possibities are just that, pending moar evidence.
https://qanon.pub/data/media/e21a467394bcafdd201afeeff0b20a7121c954a79a21e143304cdbe7d2b001c8.png
Cap from Enter WW Plaza at Deep Impact
https://youtu.be/dm47unHZBi4
Dated as 2013/2014
Kiosk rear left ridge, 4 lit bulbs. Topmost bulb in that array in this saucenwas not high enough to be captured in Q pic.
Looking in open sauces for solution to the appearance of a dim bulb (or maybe a "ghost" bulb lit by other source of light) or a partly obscured lit bulb on the rearmof kiosk's central ridge.
19-DEC-2013-P
Reverse view of Q pic. Lights on rear ridges.
In Q pic only 3 bulbs were captured on the rear of kiosk roof. From Q camera view those were on the rear right ridge of the roof.
Here, in this vid cap, the camera is at the rear, facing toward the position (or vantage) from which Q camera took pic of this kiosk in the Plaza. So, to orientate yourself, the "rear left ridge" is on the right in this vid cap.
The topmost lit bulb does not seem high enough to have been captured in Q pic. However, keep in mind that the vantage of the Q camera was prolly as high or higher than the kiosk roof.
Moar on the Q camera later.
19-DEC-2013-P
Another cap from same sauce that showed ridge lights on kiosk at night.
(In case you noticed and were wondering, am cropping vidcsps of a vloggers who shot mostly in selfie mode or swung his camera often and quickly. Caught lots of gud stuff incidental-like, over shoulder, that prolly would not be in shot if not for his selfie vlogging method.)
This view serves as an example of how distance changes perspective. In addition, this view was more elevated. The vlogger stood on entrance ramp on his way to Wilde Mous coaster ride, which was in background of Q pic. This height and elevation provides plausibility to notion that a bulb on rear of kiosk was caught in Q pic view from the other side, or frojn, of that kiosk.
Fren, got 404 when instead pic you posted.
Too many angles and vantages can induce magic eye in anyone. Here is a graf that might help. Not sure understood your query.
>LIT in one of those caps but then seeing it UNLIT in another
In both vidcaps there appeared to be 4 lit bulbs on that array, left rear ridge. Now you raise interdasting discrepancy that will need to confirm. Namely, was topmost bulb, #5, lit whilst lowest, #1, was not, and vice-versa? Or were same 4 bulbs lit the whole vid? I think topmost was unlit throughout, but will try to confirm either way.
Got 404.
>vids mixed up
There were other kiosks of this type, bears on hip roof, and of all of them just the plaza kiosk showed this asymmertry, if recall rightly.
Yes, if this was like the other kiosks, it had 4 arrays of 5 bulbs apiece. That's 20 in all. These things were loaded with lights - on length of central ridge as well as under all four eaves and under main roof too. Very bright.
But we have that evidence of a displaced and altered array for this kiosk's front right ridge. And the unlit central ridge. Plus at least one unlit bulb position in array for rear left ridge - the one we are discussing. And maybe two moar unlit, for 25-DEC-2013-P, on rear right ridge. So there were changes to the symmetry.
This was an early NOV 2013 cap which showed 5 bulb positions on four ridges, including front right. It might be moar fitting to say that there was one unlit position at #3 front right ridge and several moar across central ridge.
Yeh, at least the arrays have predictable structure with evenly spacee bulb positions. But I think the front right ridge was an exception and may have been improvised with just 4 without the underlying rigid structure.
At the outset yesterday was looking for a rear position near roof peak that may showed in Q pic. With an eye open for the symmetry query I came across this DEC vidcap. It may be the evidence that such a rear position existed and it was in Q line of sight.
To my eye, Q pic showed banner sign fully lit.
Whether or not the sign actually was fully lit on the night that it was shot IDK but it looks like it was lit-up all around - in the original Q pic.
Have added a graphic representing this banner type sign. The sides have 'folded ears' above its legs. This 'fold' at left and right shows in sauced pics as very reflective. It is a nifty effect with colous and lights. My stick drawing doesn't do it justice.
Just use the ears as two vertical lines on each side of the banner, perhaps to represent thickness or seperation. In some sauces the fold is obscured by camera settings which blur or embellish such that two vertical lines were recorded. In others the colours create illusion of a bend or interuption in the lights - esp in daytime. How these FX may happen is one thing; the purpose of the chart is to simplify the charting of observs in the images on hand. And to directly relate that to what can be seen in Q pic. If the chart can be improved, let's do it.
This a simple chart to plot where unlit areas appeared in sauced images, very roughly, as befits the pixelated Q view of that bit of WW that we've been dealt.
It's a gud stash. Used some here and in vids. Covered lots of ground, day and night.
Don't know why put 17th instead of 19th.
Vlogger's settings blasted the bulbs. Look like solar molten flares, kek.
V. Noice. Gud to keep in mind.
Fren, could you list all eaves/banner charts you have made, completed or partial, please? Will vidify your observs to help w your efforts. Will do same for few others, on request and if time allows.
Use the blanks posted here and prev breads. Post as individual chart per sauce. Label w date T or P. Add extras in post text, not chart. Like link to sauce etc.
Cheers.
Vid to assist dig, rather than report end result. Can update as needed. Think EMB shroud dig.
Will use just the eaves charts for now. Work in progress.