>>16654811

(Please read from the start)

“Descriptions of Iroquois spiritual history consistently refer to dark times of terror and misery prior to the Iroquois Confederacy, ended by the arrival of the Great Peacemaker. Tradition asserts that the Peacemaker demonstrated his authority as the Creator's messenger by climbing a tall tree above a waterfall, having the people cut down the tree, and reappearing the next morning unharmed. The Peacemaker restored mental health to a few of the most "violent and dangerous men", Ayonhwatha and Thadodaho, who then helped him bear the message of peace to others.”

>> I don’t know why but this sounds like Viracocha/Bochica . We know he traveled and taught humans civilization, culture and law. There are indications in the few words that this IS Viracocha; like:

• Arrival = as in he wasn’t there initial but traveled there.

• Dark times of terror and misery = it was chaotic before he came and people weren’t in a good situation, I think regarding to food, which caused misery.

• Great Peacemaker = he wasn’t your average peacemaker, but a GREAT one. Do you know of a greater person on earth than a Sebetti ruler? Do you know a peacemaker other than a Sebetti ruler of the Light? Christ is one of them = he is King of kings.

• Demonstrating his authority = to demonstrate authority, doesn’t this mean to show power? So he showed his power but didn’t use it to harm the people. What does that tell you?

• As the Creator’s messenger = so he presented himself as the “messenger” of the Creator = our Heavenly Father. And that is exactly what the Sebetti rulers are; they are the BRIDGE which connects us to our Heavenly Father.

• Restored mental health to a FEW of the most “violent and dangerous men” = isn’t this indicating Spiritual Healing; healing with the Holy Spirit? Notice that NOT ALL but a FEW were healed. As I’ve said before, all Sebetti rulers have the Light in them, but the most powerful one amongst them was the King of kings. It’s very possible that the other Sebetti rulers also had Spiritual Healing powers but of course not as strong as that of the King of kings.

I don’t know about you anons, but all of these hints are indicating this is Viracocha = the Sebetti ruler whom landed in the Andean Region. We already discovered that he had helpers as seen on the gateway of the Sun in Tiwanaku; so Ayonhwatha and Thadodaho might very well be just that = his helpers we see depicted with him.

We’ve already discovered part of Viracocha itinerary before in this thread as we managed to trace him back all the way to Mexico. And now we have additional indications pointing that he arrived all the way up to the Canadian-American border.

The only thing that I don’t know is what is mentioned about the tree and the waterfall. This might be pointing to some type of extraordinary “miracle” like thing he did, but I have no idea what it might be. There is also a slight possibility the tree mentioned here could be pointing to the Tree of Life; but I don’t understand how it fits in this story here.

• Page 2 305 –

>>16654845

(Please read from the start)

“After the arrival of the Europeans, some Iroquois became Christians, among them the first Native American Saint, Kateri Tekakwitha, a young woman of Mohawk-Algonquin parents. The Seneca sachem Handsome Lake, also known as Ganeodiyo, introduced a new religious system to the Iroquois in the late 18th century, which incorporated Quaker beliefs along with traditional Iroquoian culture. Handsome Lake's teachings include a focus on parenting, appreciation of life, and peace. A key aspect of Handsome Lake's teachings is the principle of equilibrium, wherein each person's talents combined into a functional community. By the 1960s, at least 50% of Iroquois followed this religion.

Dreams play a significant role in Iroquois spirituality, providing information about a person's desires and prompting individuals to fulfill dreams. To communicate upward, humans can send prayers to spirits by burning tobacco.”

>> I’m not surprised to hear there are saints among the Native Americans, regardless to which Nation/culture they belong to or the age they lived in. We all have the Light in us, all that needs to be done is to activate that Light. The Native Americans are very close to the Spirit in their culture, so they have a higher tendency to activate their Light than the rest of us = their culture is like a good environment enable the Light; for most of them, anyways.

As for dreams, well, we know a lot of people with the Light communicate through dreams. When we take a look at the saints, we will notice that there is a number of them whom communicated with the Light through dreams. Some were awake as well. We’ve already seen Saint Paisios and mostly Saint Charbel communicate through dreams with Christ themselves; and then, in turn, after becoming Saints = after their death, they themselves communicated with people via dreams as one of the many ways of communication they used. Anons can either dig about this or go back to what I’ve posted about them and re-read that section.

The Dark side also practices communication with Dark Spirit via dreams as well as other methods, such as entering into trances or taking hallucinogenic stuff. As we’ve seen in some cases before in this thread, even alcohol was used to try to communicate with the “other side”.

“Iroquois ceremonies are primarily concerned with farming, healing, and thanksgiving. Key festivals correspond to the agricultural calendar, and include Maple, Planting, Strawberry, Green Maize, Harvest, and Mid-Winter (or New Year's), which is held in early February.The ceremonies were given by the Creator to the Iroquois to balance good with evil. In the 17th century, Europeans described the Iroquois as having 17 festivals, but only 8 are observed today.The most important of the ceremonies were the New Year Festival, the Maple Festival held in late March to celebrate spring, the Sun Shooting Festival which also celebrates spring, the Seed Dance in May to celebrate the planting of the crops, the Strawberry Festival in June to celebrate the ripening of the strawberries, the Thunder Ceremony to bring rain in July, the Green Bean Festival in early August, the Green Corn Festival in late August and the Harvest Festival in October. Of all the festivals, the most important were the Green Corn Festival to celebrate the maturing of the corn and the New Year Festival. During all of the festivals, men and women from the False Face Society, the Medicine Society and the Husk Face Society would dance wearing their masks in attempt to humor the spirits that controlled nature.The most important of the occasions for the masked dancers to appear were the New Year Festival, which was felt to be an auspicious occasion to chase the malevolent spirits that were believed to cause disease.”

• Page 2 306 –

>>16654850

(Please read from the start)

“During healing ceremonies, a carved "False Face Mask" is worn to represent spirits in a tobacco-burning and prayer ritual. False Face Masks are carved in living trees, then cut free to be painted and decorated. False Faces represent grandfathers of the Iroquois, and are thought to reconnect humans and nature and to frighten illness-causing spirits. The False Face Society continues today among modern Iroquois. The Iroquois have three different medical societies. The False Face Company conducts rituals to cure sick people by driving away spirits; the Husk Face Society is made up of those who had dreams seen as messages from the spirits and the Secret Medicine Society likewise conducts rituals to cure the sick. There are 12 different types of masks worn by the societies. The types of masks are: A) The Secret Society of Medicine Men and the Company of Mystic Animals: 1) Divided mask that painted half black and half red; 2) Masks with exaggerated long noses; 3) Horn masks; 4) Blind masks without eye sockets. B) Husk Face Society: 5) Masks made of braided corn. C) False Face Society: 6) Whistling masks; 7) Masks with smiling faces; 8) Masks with protruding tongues; 9) Masks with exaggerated hanging mouths; 10) Masks with exaggerated straight lops; 11) Masks with spoon-lips; 12) Masks with a disfigured twisted mouth. The "crooked face" masks with the twisted mouths, the masks with the spoon lips and the whistling masks are the Doctor masks. The other masks are "Common Face" or "Beggar" masks that are worn by those who help the Doctors. The Husk Face Society performs rituals to communicate with the spirits in nature to ensure a good crop, the False Face Society performs rituals to chase away evil spirits and the Secret Medicine Society performs rituals to cure diseases. The grotesque masks represent the faces of the spirits that the dancers are attempting to please. Those wearing Doctor masks blow hot ashes into the faces of the sick to chase away the evil spirits that are believed to be causing the illness. The masked dancers often carried turtle shell rattles and long staffs.”

>> This paragraph reminds me of the Punic masks found in the necropolis of Carthage, which had grimaces showing in order to scare away tomb robber and evil spirits.

“Condolence ceremonies are conducted by the Iroquois for both ordinary and important people, but most notably when sachems died. Such ceremonies were still held on Iroquois reservations as late as the 1970s. After death, the soul is thought to embark on a journey, undergo a series of ordeals, and arrive in the sky world. This journey is thought to take one year, during which the Iroquois mourn for the dead. After the mourning period, a feast is held to celebrate the soul's arrival in the skyworld.

"Keepers of the faith" are part-time specialists who conduct religious ceremonies. Both men and women can be appointed as keepers of the faith by tribe elders.

Haudenosaunee thanksgiving address

The Haudenosaunee thanksgiving address is a central prayer in Haudenosaunee tradition recited daily in the beginning of school days as well as social, cultural, and political events.The address gives thanks to the parts of nature necessary to ecosystem sustainability and emphasizes the ideology that all animals within an ecosystem are connected and each plays a vital role in it.

The phrasing of the address may vary depending on the speaker but is usually composed of 17 main sections and ends with a closing prayer. The 17 main sections are: 1) The people, 2) The Earth Mother, 3) The waters, 4) The fish, 5) plants, 6) food plants,7) medicine herbs, 8) animals, 9) trees, 10) birds, 11) four winds, 12) The Thunderers, 13) The Sun, 14) Grandmother Moon, 15) The stars, 16) The Enlightened Teachers, and 17) The Creator. Within each section, gratitude is given for the gifts that section provides to humanity.

[…]”

>> That’s very nice. It’s mostly about the Clans of the Light.

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>>16654857

(Please read from the start)

“Cannibalism

Although the Iroquois are sometimes mentioned as examples of groups who practiced cannibalism, the evidence is mixed as to whether such a practice could be said to be widespread among the Six Nations, and to whether it was a notable cultural feature. Some anthropologists have found evidence of ritual torture and cannibalism at Iroquois sites, for example, among the Onondaga in the sixteenth century.However, other scholars, most notably anthropologist William Arens in his controversial book, The Man-Eating Myth, have challenged the evidence, suggesting the human bones found at sites point to funerary practices, asserting that if cannibalism was practiced among the Iroquois, it was not widespread.Modern anthropologists seem to accept the probability that cannibalism did exist among the Iroquois,with Thomas Abler describing the evidence from the Jesuit Relations and archaeology as making a "case for cannibalism in early historic times … so strong that it cannot be doubted." Scholars are also urged to remember the context for a practice that now shocks the modern Western society. Sanday reminds us that the ferocity of the Iroquois' rituals "cannot be separated from the severity of conditions … where death from hunger, disease, and warfare became a way of life".”

>> I cannot say much about this. I’m no expert and I’m far away from examining the bones. So I don’t know. In general the Iroquois give me the impression they worship the Light Clans, mostly the Great Spirit and the ThunderBirds; so cannibalism doesn’t fit in with the Light. Unless there is one Nation that is different from the others in the Iroquois Confederacy. Or another possibility is that SOME members were practicing this in secret. Also we can also assume this to be tales invented either by the Iroquois themselves to scare away the Westerners, or by the Westerners themselves exaggerated and classified every Native American they met as cannibals, regardless if it’s true or false.

“The missionaries Johannes Megapolensis, François-Joseph Bressani, and the fur trader Pierre-Esprit Radisson present first-hand accounts of cannibalism among the Mohawk. A common theme is ritualistic roasting and eating the heart of a captive who has been tortured and killed."To eat your enemy is to perform an extreme form of physical dominance."

[…]”

>> I’m not familiar with these sources, but I think they should be checked if they are authentic in what they are reporting or if it’s part of the paid experts whom have an agenda and marching orders from the Bloodlines to destroy the public image of the Iroquois. And from the sound of it, IF it turns out that cannibalism was practiced, it’s not ALL the Iroquois nations whom practiced it, but one. Again, I’m saying IF it turned out to be case. It’s better to verify this for those whom are interested in such subjects.

Thinking about it, I find many reasons why the Westerners wanted to tarnish the public image of the Iroquois, starting with the monopoly of the fur trade they can have if they take over the trade from the Iroquois. Yup! Greed can be considered a reason why the Iroquois MIGHT have been falsely accused of cannibalism. I’m not sure but if it’s the case or not though. Another reason can be ignorance of the Westerners and them seeing all non Westerners as Savages and barbaric.

• Page 2 308 –

>>16654865

(Please read from the start)

Let’s take a closer look to the Iroquois mythology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iroquois_mythology

“Much of the mythology of the Iroquois (a confederacy of originally Five, later Six Nations of Native Americans) has been preserved, including creation stories and some folktales. Stories were recorded in wampum and recited, only being written down later. The spellings of names differed as transliteration varies and spellings even in European languages were not entirely regularized. Different versions of some stories exist, reflecting different localities and different times. It is possible that the written versions were influenced by Christianity.”

>> So we didn’t get it in its pure form.

“Oral traditions

The Iroquois passed down their stories through oral tradition. Through the stories, listeners learned values, laws, and acceptable behaviors in their community. The stories were also used as a form of entertainment for the Iroquois and preserved their culture as they passed down their narratives. The stories reflected their beliefs of how they perceived and understood the world, told through expressive storytelling. Traditionally, the stories were poetic and delivered in metaphors. However, the translation of these stories often loses the expressive qualities which existed in the original language.

Each village had a storyteller who was responsible for learning all the stories by heart. No stories were ever told during the summer months to not break the law of the Jo-ga-oh. Violators who ignored the warning were said to suffer greater evils.

"Girl Who Was Not Satisfied" is an example of a traditional story about how a girl ran off with a man for his looks. The moral of the story is that people should be judged based on their character and not their looks. The story also teaches people the importance of valuing what they already have.”

>> It’s to preserve their history and acts like a moral code. This was the case for all oral tradition from all over the world.

"The Twin Gods" is an example story about the behaviors and morals of people. The two twins personify good and evil. The good twin is born normally, helped by its people, and brought good things to the world, while the evil twin had killed its mother and brought dangerous and destructive things into the world.”

>> This has more than one interpretation to it as I’ve explained before in page 2 291.

• Page 2 309 –

>>16654868

(Please read from the start)

“Creation

This version of the creation story is taken from Converse

The Earth was a thought in the mind of the ruler of a great island floating above the clouds. This ruler was called by various names, among them Ha-wen-ni-yu, meaning He who governs or The Ruler. The island is a place of calm where all needs are provided and there is no pain or death. On this island grew a great apple tree where the inhabitants held council. The Ruler said "let us make a new place where another people can grow. Under our council tree is a great sea of clouds which calls out for light." He ordered the council tree to be uprooted and he looked down into the depths. He had Ata-en-sic, Sky Woman, look down. He heard the voice of the sea calling; he told Ata-en-sic, who was pregnant, to bring it life. He wrapped her in light and dropped her down through the hole.”

>> This is truly amazing! Ata-en-sic seems like she’s Neith. She is Sky Woman because she is head of the Lamassu clan which can fly. She was pregnant. To come down from that floating island she was wrapped in light = that’s the Beam of Light with swirling electricity I’ve talked about so many times in this thread. But what about the Tree? Is it the Castle or Palace where the King of kings lived? When taking a look at Inanna in the Epic of Gilgamesh it was said that she wanted to crave a new throne from the tree; I already explained it as in she wanted new powers or a new kingdom for her = it could be pointing to the coup. We also read in that epic that the Anzu bird flew away from the tree it was residing in along with its kid. There was also a snake/serpent which settled itself in the tree.

“All the birds and animals who lived in the great cloud sea were panicked. The Duck asked "where can it rest?" "Only the earth can hold it," replied the Beaver—the oeh-dah from the bottom of our great sea—"I will get some." The Beaver dove down, but never came up. Then the Duck tried, but its dead body floated to the surface. Many of the other birds and animals tried and failed. Finally, the Muskrat returned with some earth in his paws. "It's heavy", he said, "who can support it?" The Turtle volunteered, and the earth was placed on top of his shell. When the earth was ready the birds flew up and carried Ata-en-sic on their wings to the Turtle's back.

This is how Hah-nu-nah, the Turtle, came to be the earth bearer. When he moves the sea gets rough and the earth shakes.”

>> This is not the first time we hear the earth being carried on the back of an animal. We saw such tales from the other parts of the Americas.When I read this Creation myth from the Iroquois, I am reminded of the Flood and how the land emerged slowly. This myth might be a projection/reflection of that.

“The Do-ya-no-do

Once brought to at the surface, the oeh-dah grew and became an island. Ata-en-sic heard two voices under her heart and knew her time had come. One voice was calm and quiet, but the other was loud and angry. These were the Do-yo-da-no, The Twins. The good twin, Hah-gweh-di-yu or Teharonhiakwako, was born in the normal way. The evil twin, Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh or Sawiskera, forced his way out from under his mother's arm, killing her.”

>> We already know that Neith survived the Cataclysm and lead the war against the Horned Serpent clan and their leader = the Evil Lady. So I don’t think we should take this word to word but I think this is a projection that one of the “twins” was evil and he liked to kill.

• Page 2 310 –

>>16654891

(Please read from the start)

“After the death of Sky Woman the island was shrouded in gloom. Hah-gweh-di-yu shaped the sky and created the sun from his mother's face saying "you shall rule here where your face will shine forever." Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh, however, set the great darkness in the west to drive down the sun. Hah-gweh-di-yu then took the Moon and Stars from his mother's breast, and placed them, his sisters, to guard the night sky. He gave his mother's body to the earth, the Great Mother from whom all life came.

Ga-gaah, the Crow, came from the sun land carrying a grain of corn in his ear. Hah-gweh-di-yu planted the corn above his mother's body, and it became the first grain. Ga-gaah hovers over the corn fields, guarding them from harm but also claiming his share.

Hah-gweh-di-yu, corresponding to the Huron spirit Ioskeha, created the first people. He healed disease, defeated demons, and gave many of the Iroquois magical and ceremonial rituals. Another of his gifts was tobacco, which has been used as a central part of the Iroquois religion.

Hah-gweh-di-yu is aided by a number of assistant or subordinate spirits.”

>> It’s very obvious here anons ,you don’t need me to explain things. But I have one comment: I think the world was created and people lived in it first, then the Cataclysm happened which destroyed, mutilated and totally changed the world. The world before the Cataclysm was totally different from the world after it. So I don’t think the Creation story here comes to us in its pure form since the sun, the moon, the stars and the rest were created long ago, before the Cataclysm occurred.

“Hé-no

Hé-no is the spirit of thunder. He is represented as a man dressed as a warrior, wearing on his head a magic feather that makes him invulnerable to the attacks of Hah-gweh-di-yu. On his back he carries a basket filled with pieces of chert which he launches at evil spirits and witches. It is the responsibility of Hé-no to bring rain to nourish the crops. The Iroquois address Hé-no as Tisote (Grandfather).”

>> It’s very obvious whom this is or should I say in plural = whom these are. It’s the ThunderBird warriors.

“He once lived in a cave under Niagara Falls. At that time a young girl living above the falls was engaged to marry a disagreeable old man. Rather than marry him she climbed into a canoe and headed down the river. The girl and the canoe were carried over the falls; the canoe was seen falling to destruction, but the girl disappeared. Hé-no and his two (nameless) assistants caught her in a blanket and brought her back to his cave. One of the assistants, taken with her beauty, married her.”

>> I’m not surprised to hear that a ThunderBird (along with his assistants here) was living in a cave near a water source. We’ve seen this plenty of times when taking a look at the sites in Phoenicia. Caves were used by the Clan of the ThunderBirds to live in. They also carved in mother rocks, as seen many times in this thread, to make them look like dwellings. I’ve also been suspecting this to have happened, in some shape or form, in the vicinity of Lake Titicaca in the Andean Region; before the survivors (or their direct descendants) built the City-State of Tiwanaku.

• Page 2 311 –

>>16654908

(Please read from the start)

“Later Hé-no rescued her village from a huge serpent which was devastating it with disease. He lured the serpent to a spot on Buffalo Creek where he struck it with a thunderbolt. Fatally wounded, the serpent tried to escape to the safety of Lake Erie, but died before he could get away. His body floated downstream and stuck at the head of Niagara Falls, stretching nearly across the river and arching backward. The dammed up water broke the rocks, and the whole verge of the Falls along with the snake's body fell onto the rocks below. The break formed Horseshoe Falls, but in the process destroyed Hé-no's home.”

>> Oh boy! This is exiting. It’s obvious here a battle took place between a Horned Serpent warrior and a ThunderBird warrior and the last one won. What is exiting is the cave where the ThunderBird has supposedly lived. Unfortunately, I’m sure the Bloodlines have explored and “emptied” it if there was ANYTHING in the cave, long ago (old pictures are there to show the caves were explored long ago). But nonetheless, it’s still exiting to see for one’s self where a ThunderBird lived. If you plan to visit one day, always be careful in such places because they could be very dangerous, even to experienced persons in cave exploring.

“The Dé-oh-há- ko

The name means Our Life or Our Supporters. Often called "Three Sisters" they are the spirits of corn, beans, and squash. They have the form of beautiful maidens who are fond of each other and like to live near each other. This is an analogy to the plants which grow up together, sometimes from the same hill.

One day while O-na-tah, the spirit of the corn, was wandering alone she was captured by Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh. Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh sent one of his monsters to devastate the fields, and the other sisters ran away. Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh held O-na-tah captive in darkness under the earth until a searching ray of sunl o the surface. Here she wept over the devastation of her fields and her abandonment by her two sisters. She vowed that she would never again leave her fields, and now she guards them alone, without the presence of her sisters.”

>> This myth might be a projection of a battle with a Horned Serpent warrior, but it seems fragmented and didn’t reach us in its original form.

“The Jo-ga-oh

The Jo-gä-oh, the "Little People", are invisible nature spirits, similar to the fairies of European myth. The Jo-ga-oh protect and guide all the natural world and protect the people from unseen hidden enemies.

There are three tribes of Jo-gä-oh.

The Ga-hon-ga inhabit the rivers and rocks. They live in rocky caves beside the streams and have great strength despite their small stature. They enjoy feats of strength, and have a fondness for inviting people to their habitations to compete in contests. They enjoy playing ball with rocks, tossing them high out of sight in the air, and so they are often called "Stone Throwers".

The Gan-da-yah protect and advise the fruits and grains. Their special gift is the strawberry plant; in the spring they loosen the earth so that the plant can grow. They turn the leaves toward the sun and guide the runners. The ripening of strawberries marks the spring festival. The Ho-non-di-ont, the "Company of Faith Keepers", hold dances of thanksgiving at night, with special thanks to the Jo-gä-oh for the strawberries.”

• Page 2 312 –

>>16654915

(Please read from the start)

“Throughout the growing season the Gan-da-yah guard the crops against disease and other pests.

They sometimes visit the people in the form of birds: a robin for good news, an owl for a warning, a bat bringing news of an immanent life-and-death struggle.

The most minute harmless insect or worm may be the bearer of important "talk" from the "Little People" and is not destroyed for the "trail is broad enough for all".

The Oh-do-was inhabit the shadowy places under the earth. In this underworld there are forests and animals, including a white buffalo. The Oh-do-was guard against poisonous snakes and creatures of death that try to escape from the underworld. From time to time the Oh-do-was emerge from the underworld at night into the world above. There they hold festivals and dance in rings around trees in the forest where the grass afterwards doesn't grow.”

>> I honestly don’t think real fairies exist like that. There is a possibility these might be dwarves or should I say short people or warriors of the Light. They are good and they are helping people around and protecting them from Horned Serpent attacks. If you think this is not possible, then I would like to remind you that Bes from Ancient Egypt was a dwarf and he was a warrior from the Feline Clan. All, I’m saying is that it’s possible to have a similar case here but it got mutated with the younger generation and the dwarves were understood to be fairies. Again, I’m stressing out this is a possibility.

The last paragraph is fascinating as it brings forth once more the idea of humans or beings living underground; or as some call it’s about the hollow earth theory. It’s also said that there is a creature of death which is trying to escape from the underworld but Oh-do-was is kinda preventing this from happening because he is guarding against such evil beings. It’s very interesting, isn’t it anons? Is this referring to where the Evil One is “trapped”? Just thinking loud here.

“Gǎ-oh and the winds

Gǎ-oh is the personification of the wind. A giant, he is an "instrumentality through whom the Great Spirit moves the elements". His home is in the far northern sky. Here he controls the four winds: north wind (Bear), west wind (Panther), east wind (Moose), and south wind (Fawn).

The North Wind is personified by a bear spirit named Ya-o-gah. Ya-o-gah could destroy the world with his fiercely cold breath, but is kept in check by Gǎ-oh. Ne-o-ga, the fawn, is the south wind, "gentle, and kind as the sunbeam". The West Wind, the panther Da-jo-ji, "can climb the high mountains, and tear down the forests… carry the whirlwind on [his] back, and toss the great sea waves high in the air, and snarl at the tempests" O-yan-do-ne, the moose, is the East Wind, who blows his breath "to chill the young clouds as they float through the sky".”

>> Gǎ-oh is a ThunderBird. I wonder if the 4 types of wind mentioned here are 4 types of attacks of the ThunderBird.

• Page 2 313 –

>>16654927

(Please read from the start)

“So-son-do-wah

So-son-do-wah was a great hunter, known for stalking a supernatural elk. He was captured by Dawn, a goddess who needed him as a watchman. He fell in love with Gendenwitha ("she who brings the day"; alternate spelling: Gendewitha), a human woman. He tried to woo her with a song. In spring, he sang as a bluebird, in summer as a blackbird and in autumn as a hawk, who then tried to take Gendenwitha with him to the sky. Dawn tied him to her doorpost. She changed Gendenwitha into the Morning Star, so the hunter could watch her all night but never be with her.”

>> This is rather interesting. He changed into many birds to woo a lady. And she changed him into the morning star. It’s obvious this myth didn’t retain its original form. It’s faintly connected to a distant past.

“Flying Head

The Flying Head (moh:Kanontsistóntie's) is a monster in the form of a giant disembodied head as tall as a man. It is covered with thick hair, has long black wings and long sharp claws. It comes at night to the homes of widows and orphans, beats its wings on the walls of the houses, and issues terrifying cries in an unknown language. A few days after its visit death claims one of the family. The Seneca name Dagwanoenyent means "whirlwind".”

>> We’ve already seen this one.

“Djodi'kwado

Djodi'kwado' was a horned serpent who inhabited the depths of rivers and lakes. He was capable of taking on the form of a man and seducing young women. He features prominently in the tales "The Horned Serpent Runs Away with a Young Wife who is Rescued by the Thunderer"and "Thunder Destroys Horned Snake".In "The Great Serpent and the Young Wife" he appears as a helpful being, although his help proves less than useful. He was attacked and may have been killed by Hé-no.”

>> No need for me to explain here.

“Tuscarora legend

Virginia surveyor William Byrd II, in his History of the Dividing Line Betwixt North Carolina and Virginia (1728), recorded a tradition of a former religious leader, which had been current among the Tuscarora tribe. They were an Iroquoian-speaking tribe historically settled in North Carolina that, because of warfare, migrated to join the rest of the Iroquois Confederacy in New York.”

• Page 2 314 –

>>16654931

(Please read from the start)

“[H]owever, their God, being unwilling to root them out for their crimes, did them the honour to send a Messenger from Heaven to instruct them, and set Them a perfect Example of Integrity and kind Behavior towards one another. But this holy Person, with all his Eloquence and Sanctity of Life, was able to make very little Reformation amongst them. Some few Old Men did listen a little to his Wholesome Advice, but all the Young fellows were quite incorrigible. They not only Neglected his Precepts, but derided and Evil Entreated his Person. At last, taking upon him to reprove some Young Rakes of the Conechta Clan very sharply for their impiety, they were so provok'd at the Freedom of his Rebukes, that they tied him to a Tree, and shot him with Arrows through the Heart. But their God took instant vengeance on all who had a hand in that Monstrous Act, by Lightning from Heaven, & has ever since visited their Nation with a continued Train of Calamities, nor will he ever leave off punishing, and wasting their people, till he shall have blotted every living Soul of them out of the World.”

>> I have a huge smile on my face. This is Viracocha with his staff striking lightning here. We’ve already talked a bit about this deity before. Here we have more details as to what happened.The person whom wrote this is very biased though and he very clearly dislikes the Native Americans.

“The Three Brothers Who Followed the Sun under the Sky's Rim

This is an Iroquois sun myth based on three brothers who tire of being on earth and decide to chase the sun and end up in the sky. Two of the three brothers succeed with the third succeeding in spirit only. The Sun Spirit remakes and tests the two brothers, who end up staying in the realm of the sky for many years. They miss their home and end up returning, only to find that many years have passed. With mostly everything they knew either changed or gone, they long to return to the realm of the sky, which happened when they were both struck by lightning as earthly perils could not harm them.”

>> I could be wrong, but this sounds like 3 ThunderBirds.

This is it for this Wikipedia page.

• Page 2 315 –

>>16654932

(Please read from the start)

I have also found Iroquois Creation myth from another source. I’m going to put it, it’s very interesting and I will only comment when it’s about something we haven’t talked about before: facweb.st-agnes.org/home/pmcfarlin/html/IroquoisCreationStory.html

“The Iroquois Creation Story1

A Tale of the Foundation of the Great Island, Now North America; the Two Infants Born, and the Creation of the Universe (rec. 1827)

Among the ancients there were two worlds in existence. The lower world was in great darkness;—the possession of the great monster; but the upper world was inhabited by humankind; and there was a woman conceived and would have the twin born. When her travail drew near, and her situation seemed to produce a great distress on her mind, and she was induced by some of her relations to lay herself on a mattress which was prepared, so as to gain refreshments to her wearied body; but while she was asleep the very place sunk down towards the dark world.”

>> Oh boy! Oh boy! The big 3 notables in bold red:

1 – We have an upper world and a lower world. The upper world was already inhabited by “humans” but not the lower one; this one was in great darkness.

2 – The mattress she laid in order to gain refreshments to her wearied body: doesn’t this sound like the Med Beds we’ve talked about in this thread before. It reminds me of the Stargate movie where Ra sleeps in his special “bed” to rejuvenates himself and repair his body. Here, it sounds exactly the same thing. But I guess since the Native American didn’t know what a Med Bed is, then, they worded it this way. Of course, we must note the birth of the twins.

3 – It’s while she was asleep that the place she was in, SUNK DOWN into the lower dark word. Here it can mean 3 things:

A - We can take the meaning in a literal way and say that the upper world sank while she was sleeping or taking a nap. But I really doubt it’s as simple as her sleeping peacefully because for the upper world to sink it means something very big and bad happened for it to “fall” and sink. In other words something like a catastrophe must have had happened which will wake any person sleeping if it occurred. What made the upper world sink is none other than the Cataclysm I’ve been talking about in this thread and I can assure you not a single person would sleep like a lamb while that was taking place. So I don’t think this is to be taken literally.

B – For such a great calamity to occur = the upper world falling and sinking into the dark lower world and the lady in question not waking up while she seems to be sleeping in a Med Bed…this got me thinking her sleep might have been artificially induced. Could she be in some sort of hibernation? When the Med Bed is repairing the body, does it lead to some sort of “forced state of sleep”? If not, is it something like coma?

• Page 2 316 –

>>16654942

(Please read from the start)

C – The last possibility is that “her sleep” is not pointing to the act of sleeping but to the time of the day, as in we sleep during the NIGHT. Humans do the act of sleeping mostly at night = to rest, while they are active during the day – not much sleep done during the day, unless you take a nap. So here, it could mean that the upper world sunk when it was the time to sleep = night time.

We also know that during night time, we sleep so that our body can recover. So does this mean the first possibility (A) was wrong? Well, maybe, or maybe not. See, when we sleep, it’s automatically considered to recover our body and we don’t need to say it out loud and mention it. It’s a natural process. So why mention that she needed to sleep in order to recover if it’s already done naturally? I think it’s because the sort of recovery pointed to here is beyond the “normal/standard” recovery done when you are asleep = using a Med Bed.

Also, when I regroup this piece of information with the rest of what I found in the other sources from other parts in the world, it’s more than clear that the Cataclysm was trigger = the explosion happened during the night or at most, at the early moments of dawn. So, this passage also fits into that story of how the Cataclysm was triggered when they say that the upper world sunk while she was asleep.

“The monsters of the great water were alarmed at her appearance of descending to the lower world; in consequence all the species of the creatures were immediately collected into where it was expected she would fall. When the monsters were assembled, and they made consultation, one of them was appointed in haste to search the great deep, in order to procure some earth, if it could be obtained; accordingly the monster descends, which succeeds, and returns to the place. Another requisition was presented, who would be capable to secure the woman from the terrors of the great water, but none was able to comply except a large turtle came forward and made proposal to them to endure her lasting weight, which was accepted.”

>> I wonder why, at first, the word “monsters” was used here and not animals. While I continued reading, I kept on having this feeling their size was huge…so what kind of MANY animals could we have that are big in size, for most of them anyway? All I could think of is actually the dinosaurs. They could be considered as monsters to modern day man. Crazy, right?

While in the other version we read the names = types of animals that went down to get some earth; here we don’t but instead they are called “monsters”. I think the reason behind the naming of the animal types in the other version is a mutation where younger generations didn’t understand what these monsters are and substituted them while telling the myth with the names of animals they were acquainted with.

The last point which caught my attention is the use of the word “earth” = they wanted to procure some earth for her. They didn’t use soil, dirt, mud….they used “earth” which could have a double meaning. As volcanic peaks emerged from under the water where she landed….just like what Kilimanjaro and Ararat are = volcanic peaks.

• Page 2 317 –

>>16654958

(Please read from the start)

“The woman was yet descending from a great distance. The turtle executes upon the spot, and a small quantity of earth was varnished on the back part of the turtle. The woman alights on the seat prepared, and she receives a satisfaction. While holding her, the turtle increased every moment and became a considerable island of earth, and apparently covered with small bushes. The woman remained in a state of unlimited darkness, and she was overtaken by her travail to which she was subject.”

>> Wow! It’s as if she fell from Space towards the Earth.

“While she was in the limits of distress one of the infants in her womb was moved by an evil opinion and he was determined to pass out under the side of the parent's arm, and the other infant in vain endeavored to prevent his design. The woman was in a painful condition during the time of their disputes, and the infants entered the dark world by compulsion, and their parent expired in a few moments. They had the power of sustenance without a nurse, and remained in the dark regions.”

>> So according to this myth, she was in labor while the upper world fell and she was carrying twins: one evil and the other one good. But I don’t think this myth should be taken word to word as written because if we compare it with what we have from other sources, it’s clear the twins were born before the Cataclysm, not during/after it. So the way I explain this is that this story was cut in many places and put back together, a bit like what you do with a film roll while editing a movie (old times). The reason behind it is because it’s oral tradition = so some parts must have been cut short and others glued to it or not in the right sequel of events they should be in.

“After a time the turtle increased to a great Island and the infants were grown up, and one of them possessed with a gentle disposition, and named Enigorio, i.e. the good mind. The other youth possessed an insolence of character, and was named Enigonhahetgea, i.e. the bad mind. The good mind was not contented to remain in a dark situation, and he was anxious to create a great light in the dark world; but the bad mind was desirous that the world should remain in a natural state.”

>> Here, it’s clearly saying that the Flood water receded slowly and land started to emerge from under the water gradually. The Evil Clan survivors wanted to keep the world and the people in a state of chaos, while the clans of the Light, united, wanted to bring order to the new world. This is how I interpret this paragraph.

“The good mind determines to prosecute his designs, and therefore commences the world of creation. At first he took the parent's head, (the deceased) of which he created an orb, and established it in the centre of the firmament, and it became of a very superior nature to bestow light to the new world, (now the sun) and again he took the remnant of the body and formed another orb, which was inferior to the light (now moon). In the orb a cloud of legs appeared to prove it was the body of the good mind, (parent). The former was to give light to the day and the latter to the night; and he also created numerous spots of light, (now stars): these were to regulate the days, nights, seasons, years, etc.”

• Page 2 318 –

>>16654965

(Please read from the start)

>> Of course this is not to be taken literally. I was also wondering something: when the upper world sunk = as in the explosion happened and the Cataclysm started….is it possible that the “upper world” “broke” into 2 parts, 2 blocks and one fell on Earth and the other stayed floating in orbit of the Earth? (((They))) told us that it was a meteorite that fell from Space into Earth and destroyed/killed/wiped out the dinosaurs. And I keep on reading strange things about the moon, that apparently it’s not a moon and stuff like that. I cannot make much sense of it all, but it perked my curiosity and I have loads of question about it all – mostly with the fake moon landings and all of that.

So I’m wondering if the upper world was not broke into 2 sections/parts/chunks and the big chunk stayed in orbit around the earth and became what now we call the moon. And the smaller chunk fell to the surface of the Earth. The fall of that smaller chunk would have been like that of a meteorite falling from Space. Let’s just consider this as a possible theory from the old man. I’m not saying this is what happened, it’s just a theory. I’m still a greenhorn with the moon riddle.

“Whenever the light extended to the dark world the monsters were displeased and immediately concealed themselves in the deep places, lest they should be discovered by some human beings. The good mind continued the works of creation, and he formed numerous creeks and rivers on the Great Island, and then created numerous species of animals of the smallest and the greatest, to inhabit the forests, and fishes of all kinds to inhabit the waters. When he had made the universe he was in doubt respecting some being to possess the Great Island; and he formed two images of the dust of the ground in his own likeness, female and male, and by his breathing into their nostrils he gave them the living souls, and named them Ea-gwe-howe, i.e., a real people; and he gave the Great Island all the animals of game for their maintenance and he appointed thunder to water the earth by frequent rains, agreeable of the nature of the system; after this the Island became fruitful and vegetation afforded the animals subsistance.”

>> This is incredible. The notables are:

1 – When the light extended to the dark world the monsters were displeased and immediately concealed themselves in deep places = did they go underground? Or is it in deep dark caves? Is this reflecting the victory of the Light Clan’s? Is this reflecting a distant past where the battle against the Horned Serpent Clan was won by the ThunderBirds? Seems like after their defeat the Horned Serpent Clan laid low, as in they hid, not just in remote places, but hid in a meaning that they wouldn’t be detected as part of the Evil Clan = they hid among the people = infiltration, in order to survive. This is not the first time this happened in History. Each time (((they))) are defeated, (((they))) survived because (((they))) used the same method as (((they))) passed on (((their))) teachings. And then, (((they))) came back after a few centuries. (((They))) stay in shadows at first, then mingled amongst us, pretending (((they))) are like us = non cannibals, while (((they))) do horrible things in the shadows. (((They))) slowly crawled up the ladder of power and started to seize the reigns one by one. This was NOT done in one place = one specific geographic zone, but it was a phenomenon which took place in the same way all over the world; which means this is part of (((their))) teachings = part of the doctrine; as in if you are caught, detected, then some of you will go underground and form sleeping cells which will hatch a few generations later and take back control from within. It’s the parasitic doctrine I’ve been warning a lot of about. But whom is listening?

• Page 2 319 –

>>16654977

(Please read from the start)

2 – Male and female were created from dust in the ground to his likeness. Of course this is similar to what we have in the Bible, but the sequence is not correct here. I mean in the Bible Creation happened first, then the banishment from the garden of Eden took place. Here, the upper world fell, then the Creation happened. This is why I said that this myth of Creation we have here is like editing a film roll and the sequence of events was messed up.

3 – Thunder was “ordered” to bring water to the earth. I think this has a double meaning: the obvious one of rain coming down; and the hint that the ThunderBirds were to “take care” of the created world and what lives in it. They are the guardians. Why do I think it’s about the ThunderBirds here and not actually rain? Well, what is thunder but a sound: “a loud rumbling or crashing noise heard after a lightning flash due to the expansion of rapidly heated air”. So why say Thunder, not storm or simply rain? Why not use the word lightning or wind as well? See what I mean? Thunder might be here, not the real thunder from a “natural” storm, but the Thunder warriors = the ThunderBirds, whom bring storms, protect people and even bring order, and law to the people when there are disagreements between them.

“The bad mind, while his brother was making the universe, went throughout the Island and made numerous high mountains and falls of water, and great steeps, and also creates various reptiles which would be injurious to humankind; but the good mind restored the Island to its former condition. The bad mind proceeded further in his motives and he made two images of clay in the form of humankind; but while he was giving them existence they became apes; and when he had not the power to create humankind he was envious against his brother; and again he made two of clay. The good mind discovered his brother's contrivances, and aided in giving them living souls, (it is said these had the most knowledge of good and evil).”

>> The notables:

1 – Connecting the evil mind to reptiles which injured humans. But the good mind restored things to the former condition. This is projecting the ancient battle between the Horned Serpent warriors and the Light warriors whom finally won and restored “order” to the world.

2- The bad mind also took clay and tried to create life but his creatures turned out to be apes in the end because he didn’t have the power to turn them into humans; he simply couldn’t give them souls. This is indicating 3 important things:

A- The projection of the Frankenstein creatures which we are suspecting the Evil One created and we know nowadays Bloodlines created in underground labs.

B- The Evil One wanted to play “God” as in the Creator; we’ve already seen this idea before in this thread.

C- Only the Light can create living humans with SOULS in them.

• Page 2 320 –

>>16654987

(Please read from the start)

“The good mind now accomplishes the works of creation, notwithstanding the imaginations of the bad mind were continually evil; and he attempted to enclose all the animals of game in the earth, so as to deprive them from humankind; but the good mind released them from confinement, (the animals were dispersed, and traces of them were made on the rocks near the cave where it was closed).

The good mind experiences that his brother was at variance with the works of creation, and feels not disposed to favor any of his proceedings, but gives admonitions of his future state. Afterwards the good mind requested his brother to accompany him, as he was proposed to inspect the game, etc., but when a short distance from their monina residence, the bad mind became so unmanly that he could not conduct his brother any more.

The bad mind offered a challenge to his brother and resolved that who gains the victory whould govern the universe; and appointed a day to meet the contest. The good mind was willing to submit to the offer, and he enters the reconciliation with his brother which he falsely mentions that by whipping with flags would destroy his temporal life; and he earnestly solicits his brother also to notice the instrument of death, which he manifestly relates by the use of deer horns, beating his body he would expire. On the day appointed the engagement commenced, which lasted for two days: after pulling up the trees and mountains as the track of a terrible whirlwind, at last the good mind gained the victory by using the horns, as mentioned the instrument of death, which he succeeded in deceiving his brother and he crushed him in the earth; and the last words uttered from the bad mind were, that he would have equal power over the souls of humankind after death; and he sinks down to eternal doom, and became the Evil Spirit. After this tumult the good mind repaired to the battle ground, and then visited the people and retires from the earth.”

>> This is a projection of the coup and the fight for the throne of Heaven. It’s in bits and pieces but it’s clear this is a fight for the throne of Heaven. The last word uttered by the evil mind are very notable “he would have equal power over the souls of humankind after death” – is this why Christ made the ultimate sacrifice so he can shred this “power” the Evil One had on us? I think so. There are loads of details pointing it’s the battle for the throne of Heaven, but as you can see the sequence is not in order and it’s kinda scrambled with the deer horns, the whirlwind etc. It’s interesting how it’s mentioned that the Evil One was crushed to death which reminds me of Zeus’ fight with Typhon. Another interesting detail is that the Evil One sank down to eternal doom.

Let’s take a quick look at the “good mind”: www.native-languages.org/morelegends/good-spirit.htm

“Native American Legends: Good Spirit

Name: Good Spirit

Native names: Enigorio; Ka'tikenhrakwahst, Got-ti-gah-rah-quast

Also known as: Good Mind, Right-Handed Twin

Tribal affiliation: Cayuga, Oneida, Tuscarora

Type: Culture hero, Native American god

Related figures in other tribes: Sky Holder (Iroquois), Ioskeha (Huron), Nanabush (Anishinabe)”

• Page 2 321 –

>>16655018

(Please read from the start)

“In the mythology of some Cayuga and Tuscarora communities, Good Spirit is one of the Twin Gods, sons of the mother goddess Sky Woman. In the mythology of other Iroquois tribes, Sky Woman was the grandmother of the legendary twins instead. Good Spirit was the protector, and according to some stories the creator, of the Iroquois people. He slew monsters, taught the people the arts of civilization, and adapted the world to help them. Meanwhile his brother, Bad Spirit, sabotaged him by undoing his work and creating dangerous and destructive things. According to most versions of the myth the two brothers eventually fought, and Good Spirit was victorious.

Other details of the Good Spirit myth vary greatly depending on the community and the storyteller. In some versions, Good Spirit is nearly identical to the Huron Ioskeha, with his mother dying in childbirth due to his wicked brother. But in many versions, Sky Woman survives and tries to mediate between her sons– most often she advocates for balance, saying that there must be both good and evil in the world, but sometimes she takes the part of Good Spirit and helps to imprison Bad Spirit, and other times she favors Bad Spirit and rejects Good Spirit for defeating him.

In some Iroquois traditions, Good Spirit is considered to be the same as the high god, known as Sky-Holder.”

>> Well, there is no need for me to explain this since we’ve already talked about it all. I put this on purpose to give a quick glimpse to anons how oral tradition can vary because each generation can add, omit or mix parts of it = just like editing a film strip of a movie. But this doesn’t mean it’s all wrong and unreliable. The core story is still there despite the scrambled sequence of events and the alterations.

I still want to look for more detail about this entire story, even if some parts are repeat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hahgwehdiyu

“Hahgwehdiyu (also called Ha-Wen-Neyu, Rawenniyo, or Hawenniyo) is the Iroquois god of goodness and light, as well as a creator god. He and his twin brother Hahgwehdaetgah, the god of evil, were children of Atahensic (or in some versions her daughter, the Earth Mother), whom Hahgwehdaetgah killed in childbirth.

Hahgwehdiyu created the world from his own body and that of his mother's. His outstretched palm became the sky, his mother's head the sun, and her breasts became the moon and stars. He made her body the earth, into which he planted a seed, which grew into the maize plant.

Creation of the Earth

The Earth was a thought in the mind of the ruler of a great island floating above the clouds. This ruler was called by various names, among them Ha-wen-ni-yu, meaning He who governs or The Ruler. The island is a place of calm where all needs are provided and there is no pain or death. On this island grew a great apple tree where the inhabitants held council. The Ruler said "let us make a new place where another people can grow. Under our council tree is a great sea of clouds which calls out for light." He ordered the council tree to be uprooted and he looked down into the depths. He had Ata-en-sic, Sky Woman, look down. He heard the voice of the sea calling; he told Ata-en-sic, who was pregnant, to bring it life. He wrapped her in light and dropped her down through the hole.”

>> Ha-wen-ni-yu is the King of kings. He wrapped her in light and dropped her down through the hole = this is the beam of light with swirling electricity. We also have seen it many times in this thread, and we’ve seen something similar in the movie Stargate with the teleportation rings….and of course we all know that Christ and the Virgin Mary went up to Heaven in their bodies with a light shining down on them. The rest: about the floating mountain and the “council”, is supporting what I have been telling you in this thread and it’s a match to what we have from other myths from different parts of the world; like the Epic of Gilgamesh, or the myths of Inanna, etc.

• Page 2 322 –

>>16655023

(Please read from the start)

“Once brought to at the surface, the oeh-dah grew and became an island. Ata-en-sic heard two voices under her heart and knew her time had come. One voice was calm and quiet, but the other was loud and angry. These were the Do-yo-da-no, The Twins. The good twin, Hah-gweh-di-yu or Teharonhiakwako, was born in the normal way. The evil twin, Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh or Sawiskera, forced his way out from under his mother's arm, killing her.

After the death of Sky Woman the island was shrouded in gloom. Hah-gweh-di-yu shaped the sky and created the sun from his mother's face saying "you shall rule here where your face will shine forever." Hä-qweh-da-ět-gǎh, however, set the great darkness in the west to drive down the sun. Hah-gweh-di-yu then took the Moon and Stars from his mother's breast, and placed them, his sisters, to guard the night sky. He gave his mother's body to the earth, the Great Mother from whom all life came.

Hah-gweh-di-yu, corresponding to the Huron spirit Ioskeha, created the first people. He healed disease, defeated demons, and gave many of the Iroquois magical and ceremonial rituals. Another of his gifts was tobacco, which has been used as a central part of the Iroquois religion.

Hah-gweh-di-yu is aided by a number of assistant or subordinate spirits.”

>> Well, we’ve seen this before, but it’s good to read various accounts about it. Sometimes little details are collected from here and there.

Just a bit about Atahensic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atahensic

“In Iroquois mythology, Atahensic (also called Ataensic or Eagentci) is an Iroquois sky goddess. Atahensic is associated with marriage, childbirth, and feminine affairs in general.

According to legend, at the time of creation, a tree broke and left a hole in the ground that led to the centre of the Earth. Atahensic fell from the sky, and before falling into the hole left by the tree, she was carried down on the wings of birds. After her fall, the birds brought her down the hole onto water. A giant turtle then emerged from the underground waters and carried her to the surface. She then gave birth to Earth Mother, who in turn gave birth to Hahgwehdiyu and Hahgwehdaetgah, twin sons. Hahgwehdaetgah, the evil twin, killed Earth Mother by bursting out of her side during birth. Hahgwehdiyu, the good twin, then planted a seed into his mother's corpse. From this seed grew maize, as a gift to mankind.

"This [Atahensic] is the Huron name for the first mother, and not that of the (confederated) Iroquois. The Senecas generally give this character no name other than Eagentci, literally old woman or ancient bodied."

>> The little variant is that she came down with the help of birds and not the light as we read in the previous article.

This is it for the myths from the Iroquois

• Page 2 323 –

>>16655025

(Please read from the start)

Next, I want to take a look at the Hopi mythology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hopi_mythology

“The Hopi maintain a complex religious and mythological tradition stretching back over centuries. However, it is difficult to definitively state what all Hopis as a group believe. Like the oral traditions of many other societies, Hopi mythology is not always told consistently and each Hopi mesa, or even each village, may have its own version of a particular story, but "in essence the variants of the Hopi myth bear marked similarity to one another." It is also not clear that the stories told to non-Hopis, such as anthropologists and ethnographers, represent genuine Hopi beliefs or are merely stories told to the curious while keeping safe the more sacred Hopi teachings. As folklorist Harold Courlander states, "there is a Hopi reticence about discussing matters that could be considered ritual secrets or religion-oriented traditions.”

In addition, the Hopis have always been willing to assimilate foreign ideas into their cosmology if they are proven effective for such practical necessities as bringing rain. The Hopi had at least some contact with Europeans as early as the 16th century, and some believe that European Christian traditions may have entered Hopi cosmology at some point. Indeed, Spanish missions were built in several Hopi villages starting in 1629 and were in operation until the Pueblo Revolt of 1680. However, after the revolt, it was the Hopi alone of all the Pueblo peoples who kept the Spanish out of their villages permanently, and regular contact with whites did not begin again until nearly two centuries later. The Hopi mesas have therefore been seen as "relatively unacculturated" at least through the early 20th century, and it may be posited that the European influence on the core themes of Hopi mythology was slight.”

>> Good! The closer the myths to the original, the better it is.

“Most Hopi creation stories center around Tawa, the sun spirit. Tawa is the creator, and it was he who formed the "First World" out of Tokpella, or endless space, as well as its original inhabitants. It is still traditional for Hopi mothers to seek a blessing from the sun for their newborn children. Other accounts have it that Tawa, or Taiowa, first created Sotuknang, whom he called his nephew, and sent him to create the nine universes according to his plan. Sotuknang also created Spider Woman, who served as a messenger for the creator and was an intercessor between the deity and the people. In some versions of the Hopi creation myth, she creates all life, under the direction of Sotuknang. Yet other stories tell that life was created by Hard Being Woman of the West and Hard Being Woman of the East, while the sun merely observed the process.”

>> There you go anons: we have the King of kings and Neith at the center of the Creation myth of the Hopi.

“Major deities

Masauwu (Maasaw, Mausauu), Skeleton Man, was the Spirit of Death, Earth God, door keeper to the Fifth World, and the Keeper of Fire. He was also the Master of the Upper World, or the Fourth World, and was there when the good people escaped the wickedness of the Third World for the promise of the Fourth. Masauwu is described as wearing a hideous mask, but again showing the diversity of myths among the Hopi, Masauwu was alternately described as a handsome, bejewelled man beneath his mask or as a bloody, fearsome creature. He is also assigned certain benevolent attributes. One story has it that it was Masauwu who helped settle the Hopi at Oraibi and gave them stewardship over the land. He also charged them to watch for the coming of the Pahana (see section below), the Lost White Brother. Other important deities include the twin war gods, the kachinas, and the trickster, Coyote.”

>> Skeleton Man sounds like the Evil One, or a member of his clan. Masauwu is also the Evil One but seen in his 2 aspects: when he was a good Sebetti ruler and when he turned into an evil Sebetti ruler.

• Page 2 324 –

>>16655027

(Please read from the start)

“Maize is vital to Hopi subsistence and religion. "For traditional Hopis, corn is the central bond. Its essence, physically, spiritually, and symbolically, pervades their existence. For the people of the mesas corn is sustenance, ceremonial object, prayer offering, symbol, and sentient being unto itself. Corn is the Mother in the truest sense that people take in the corn and the corn becomes their flesh, as mother milk becomes the flesh of the child."

Four Worlds

Barry Pritzker writes: "According to Hopi legend, when time and space began, the sun spirit (Tawa) created the First World, in which insectlike creatures lived unhappily in caves. With the goal of improvement, Tawa sent a spirit called Spider Grandmother to the world below. Spider Grandmother led the first creatures on a long trip to the Second World, in which they took on the appearance of wolves and bears. As these animals were no happier than the previous ones, however, Tawa created a new, Third World, and again sent Spider Grandmother to convey the wolves and bears there. By the time they arrived. they had become people." Spider Grandmother taught them weaving and pottery, and a hummingbird brought them a fire drill.”

>> Of course this is NOT to be taken literally as it’s clear here editing happened while the myth was transferred through the generations. What is interesting though is the idea of the existence of not ONE world, but as many as 4 worlds. This is a notion that we’ve already encountered in this thread in other civilizations/cultures, like that of the Aztecs (if my memory is not betraying me) and in Ancient Egypt as well.

“Entrance into the Fourth World

Two main versions exist as to the Hopis' emergence into the present Fourth World.

In one version, after evil broke out amongst the people in the Third World, with the help of Spider Grandmother, or bird spirits, a hollow bamboo reed grew at the opening of the Third World into the Fourth World. This opening, sipapu, is traditionally viewed to be the Grand Canyon. According to Barry Pritzker, "the people with good hearts (kindness) made it to the Fourth World.”

>> A lot of anons/researchers think the Sipapu is actually the stargate/portal and I agree with them. It’s that beam of light with electricity swirling around it from what is written in this paragraph.

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>>16655075

(Please read from the start)

“The other version (mainly told in Oraibi) has it that Tawa destroyed the Third World in a great flood. Before the destruction, Spider Grandmother sealed the more righteous people into hollow reeds which were used as boats. On arrival on a small piece of dry land, the people saw nothing around them but more water, even after planting a large bamboo shoot, climbing to the top, and looking about. Spider Woman then told the people to make boats out of more reeds, and using island "stepping-stones" along the way, the people sailed east until they arrived on the mountainous coasts of the Fourth World.”

>> The King of kings didn’t cause the Cataclysm, He tried to stop it. The Cataclysm was most probably triggered by the Evil One. So it wasn’t Tawa whom destroyed the Third World in a great flood; the flood which was a tiny part of the Cataclysm. This is clear indication of what I’ve been telling you about the editing of the myth by the younger generations of the Native Americans. And this is not exclusively done with the Native Americans as it happened worldwide with every Oral tradition out there.

Now look at the juicy parts in this paragraph: the Kuphar was made of reeds = here Spider Grandmother used the reeds as boats in which she SEALED good people. This is pointing to the ARKS, in plural, not a single Ark. After that the description given to us is what happened after the Arks landed on the small volcanic mountain top which emerged from under the water. It’s incredible, isn’t it anons? Here the text, despite the scrambling, supports the archaeological and geological finds we’ve been seeing in this thread.

Did you notice that the survivors sailed EAST after they came out of the ARKS and made MORE REED boats? This is supporting what I said about the rivers in the States and how the Rocky mountain might be the place where the Arks rested (page 2 289). We have 3 possible states where the Arks might have landed: Colorado, Wyoming and Montana. As you can see on the maps, the survivors could have easily built reed boats and used them to navigate on the respective river flowing East from each state and reach the Mississippi river; or go anywhere else.

“While it may not be possible to positively ascertain which is the original or "more correct" story, Harold Courlander writes, at least in Oraibi (the oldest of the Hopi villages), little children are often told the story of the sipapu, and the story of an ocean voyage is related to them when they are older. He states that even the name of the Hopi Water Clan (Patkinyamu) literally means "a dwelling-on-water" or "houseboat". However, he notes the sipapu story is centered on Walpi and is more accepted among Hopis generally.”

>> This surely fits the description of the Arks, mostly with that dwelling on water.

“According to Barry Pritzker, "In this Fourth World, the people learned many lessons about the proper way to live. They learned to worship Masauwu, who ensured that the dead return safely to the Underworld and who gave them the four sacred tablets that, in symbolic form, outlined their wanderings and their proper behavior in the Fourth World. Masauwu also told the people to watch for the Pahána, the Lost White Brother.”

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>>16655076

(Please read from the start)

“Migrations

Upon their arrival in the Fourth World, the Hopis divided and went on a series of great migrations throughout the land. Sometimes they would stop and build a town, then abandon it to continue on with the migration. They would leave their symbols behind on the rocks to show that Hopi had been there. Long the divided people wandered in groups of families, eventually forming clans named after an event or sign that a particular group received upon its journey.These clans would travel for some time as a unified community, but almost inevitably a disagreement would occur, the clan would split and each portion would go its separate way. However, as the clans traveled, they would often join together forming large groups, only to have these associations disband, and then be reformed with other clans. These alternate periods of harmonious living followed by wickedness, contention, and separation play an important part of the Hopi mythos. This pattern seemingly began in the First World and continues even into recent history.”

>> This is an extremely important paragraph which is telling what happened after the survivors got out of the Arks and the water level receded. I’ve been trying to explain this over and over again in this thread because this is EXACTLY what we discovered had happened in Mesopotamia at the border of the Taurus mountain chain. The old settlements like Mount Nemrut were abandoned and people migrated in many waves downstream Euphrates. The group split many times and re-grouped, reformed….as we’ve seen with the story of Hayk, the Armenian Patriarch. This was also the situation in the Andean Region, in Ancient Egypt and in Mesoamerica, as we’ve seen old settlements or City-States were abandoned and migrations took place and regrouping occurred. We also have seen them leaving behind them a trail of petroglyphs, and sometimes geoglyphs as the migrants traveled. This is what I’ve been explaining on and on to anons. This paragraph is extremely important as I just said, please read and re-read all over again because it applies to ALL the starting points we’ve seen so far, where the Arks might have landed. The ruins, the Tells and the petroglyphs are there to prove this; the texts support them.

“In the course of their migration, each Hopi clan was to go to the farthest extremity of the land in every direction. Far in the north was a land of snow and ice which was called the "Back Door", but this was closed to the Hopi. However, the Hopi say that other peoples came through the Back Door into the Fourth World. "Back Door" could refer to the Bering land bridge, which connected Asia with North America. The Hopi were led on their migrations by various signs, or were helped along by Spider Woman. Eventually, the Hopi clans finished their prescribed migrations and were led to their current location in northeastern Arizona.”

>> The migrations (worldwide) happened in ALL direction, not in one direction of course. Following the river is one of itinerary followed, but it’s not the only and exclusive one. The Hopi said that they met with other people whom came through the Back Door = this is indicating that another Arks landed somewhere in the land of snow = Canada and the survivors also migrated, settled and resettled many times = they were on the move too. I think this is due to the changes in the climate = the Ice Age which followed the Flood and of course the flood water levels receding. I’ve said many times that the Flood is PART of the Cataclysm, not the Cataclysm itself. The Cataclysm itself was made of many horrifying events/ disasters which includes the Flood as one of them. After the Flood calmed down, and Ice Age occurred.

“Most Hopi traditions have it that they were given their land by Masauwu, the Spirit of Death and Master of the Fourth World.”

>> Which brings the questions: were the Hopi originaly part of the Horned Serpent Clan? Or was the “leader” of the Hopi part of the Horned Serpent Clan? From this sentence, it sounds like it was.

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>>16655077

(Please read from the start)

“Perhaps the most important was said to be in the possession of the Fire Clan, and is related to the return of the Pahana. In one version, an elder of the Fire Clan worried that his people would not recognize the Pahana when he returned from the east. He therefore etched various designs including a human figure into a stone, and then broke off the section of the stone which included the figure's head. This section was given to Pahana and he was told to bring it back with him so that the Hopi would not be deceived by a witch or sorcerer. This one is Truth, the stone has an Indian face of black, white and grey with black feathers, and it is not etched but looks more like ink that soaked into the stone.”

>> Fire is the element of the Evil One. Were the Hopi waiting for the return of the Evil One?

“Sacred Hopi tablets

Hopi tradition tells of sacred tablets which were imparted to the Hopi by various deities. Like most of Hopi mythology, accounts differ as to when the tablets were given and in precisely what manner.

>> Not much said about the Hopi sacred tablets

“Kachinas

One of the Hopi religious societies is the katsina society. According to Barry Pritzker, "Reflecting the close association between the world of the living and that of the dead, spirits play an integral role in the land of the living. They are associated with clouds and with benevolent supernatural entities called katsinam (the plural of katsina), which inhabit the San Francisco Peaks just north of Flagstaff, Arizona." According to Susanne and Jake Page, the katsinam are "the spirits of all things in the universe, of rocks, stars, animals, plants, and ancestors who have lived good lives.”

Around 1325 CE Kachina masks and Kachina dancers appear as rock art.

Raymond Friday Locke discusses the Hopi legend of the Pahana writing that "The Hopis…had long anticipated the coming of Pahana and, either by coincidence or because of a common root of the legends, Pahana was due to visit the Hopi in the very same year that Quetzalcoatl was expected to return to the Aztecs. He arrived some twenty-one years later in the person of the Spaniard Pedro de Tovar, one of Coronado's conquistadors, and was the first white man to be seen by the Hopis and very probably the Navajo. Unlike the Aztecs, the Hopis put this Spanish Pahana to a series of tests, and when he failed them they sent him on his way.”

>> I want to make a clarification (which I made before): There are 2 deities with the name of Quetzalcoatl. One is evil, worshiped by the Aztecs and is his name means the “Precious Snake”; he is simply called Quetzalcoatl: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatl

The second one is good deity whom was against human sacrifice, known by the Toltecs (see page 254), whom comes with the extremely long name of: Cē Ācatl Topiltzin Quetzalcoatl (starting page 256), which I’m unable to utter and I struggle with the name. This is why I keep the name short using only Quetzlcoatl to refer this “good” deity. So everything I’ve talked about before about Viracocha being Bocchica being Quetzalcoatl I was pointing to this second deity = the good one; and NOT to the evil one worshiped by the Aztecs, not the serpent one.

So here, when they say that the Pahana of the Hopi has common roots with Quetzalcoatl, they are pointing to the serpent deity of the Aztecs, the evil deity.

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>>16655089

(Please read from the start)

“The Hopi say that during a great drought, they heard singing and dancing coming from the San Francisco Peaks. Upon investigation, they met the Kachinas who returned with the Hopi to their villages and taught them various forms of agriculture. The Hopi believe that for six months of the year, Kachina spirits live in the Hopi villages. The nine day Niman or Going Home ceremony concludes the Kachina season with an outdoor Kachina Dance where the line of Kachinas bring harvest gifts for the spectators and Kachina dolls for the young girls. Different sets of Kachinas perform year. Most favored is the Hemis group of Kachinas who perform accompanied by a variety of Kachina manas. After the Going Home Dance in late-July or early-August, the Kachinas return to the San Francisco Peaks for six months. The Hopi believe that these dances are vital for the continued harmony and balance of the world. It serves the further and vital purpose of bringing rain to the Hopi's parched homeland.

Pahana

The true Pahana (or Bahana) is the Lost White Brother of the Hopi. Most versions have it that the Pahana or Elder Brother left for the east at the time that the Hopi entered the Fourth World and began their migrations. However, the Hopi say that he will return again and at his coming the wicked will be destroyed and a new age of peace, the Fifth World, will be ushered into the world. As mentioned above, it is said he will bring with him a missing section of a sacred Hopi stone in the possession of the Fire Clan, and that he will come wearing red. Traditionally, Hopis are buried facing east in expectation of the Pahana who will come from that direction.”

>> It’s very obvious whom is it about here anons, so I’m not going to comment much except saying that the Evil Clan believes the Evil One will be resurrected. It’s not the first time we’ve seen this in this thread; it’s the reason (((they))) are trying to open the portal after all. Also don’t forget that the Evil One was of the White race.

“The legend of the Pahana seems intimately connected with the Aztec story of Quetzalcoatl, and other legends of Central America.This similarity is furthered by the liberal representation of Awanyu or the Paluliikon, the horned or plumed serpent, in Hopi and other Puebloan art. This figure resembles Quetzacoatl, the feathered serpent, of Mexico. In the early 16th century, both the Hopis and the Aztecs believed that the coming of the Spanish conquistadors was the return of this lost white prophet. Unlike the Aztecs, upon first contact the Hopi put the Spanish through a series of tests in order to determine their divinity, and having failed, the Spanish were sent away from the Hopi mesas.

One account has it that the Hopi realized that the Spanish were not the Pahana based upon the destruction of a Hopi town by the Spanish. Thus when the Spanish arrived at the village of Awatovi, they drew a line of cornmeal as a sign for the Spanish not to enter the village, but this was ignored. While some Hopi wanted to fight the invaders, it was decided to try a peaceful approach in the hope that the Spanish would eventually leave. However, Spanish accounts record a short skirmish at Awatovi before the Hopis capitulated.

In popular culture

[…]”

>> The Evil One is long dead when the survivors came out from the Arks and migrated to lower, more fertile lands. So there is no way it was the Evil One himself whom traveled East and said he will return. But it’s obvious it was a member of the Evil Clan, like maybe a Horned Serpent warrior whom said that to the Hopi. I mean a Horned Serpent warrior might have said to the Hopi that his Sebetti ruler = the Evil One = (((their))) creator, founding father, will come back one day. And then, this Horned Serpent traveled East.

There are some interesting points that caught my attention while reading about the Hopi mythology, I’m going to check them out next.

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>>16655094

(Please read from the start)

Let’s start with the Hopi’s skeleton man: https://www.ancientpages.com/2017/05/05/hopis-encounter-maasaw-skeleton-man-gift-sacred-knowledge/

“Hopi’s Encounter With Maasaw – The Skeleton Man And His Gift Of Sacred Knowledge

May 5, 2017

The Hopi Indians’ encounter with Maasaw was very emotional and frightening.”

>> Just one sentence and I can understand why the Hopi Indians reacted this way during their encounter with Maasaw. I’m putting some pictures of hand crafted dolls of Maasaw with this page.These are samples. It would be better for the reader whom is interested to go online and check them out because there are loads of variants in the design of the Maasaw doll.

First of all, let’s be clear: you don’t get frightened by angelic, nice looking entities. You get frightened by horrible looking ones, which are none other than monsters or demons. Look at the dolls in the pictures with this page: in his right hand he is holding a rattle (most of the time) while in his left hand, he holds various objects, sometimes it’s a staff or bones (depending on the design). Sometimes the bones are not in his left hand, but are hanging from his belt on the front. His head is terribly strange, isn’t it? I think it’s because he is wearing a helmet. What is coming out/sticking out from the top of the head looks a lot like antlers. His eyes are as if he was actually wearing goggles. His mouth is also depicted strangely. I don’t think he is doing a big O with his mouth. I think his mouth is wide open, ready to bite. Just like what a lion does when he is about to bite into his prey. Why do I think his mouth is depicted in a way indicating that he is about to bite? = it’s because of the teeth.

When I combine all of these details from the iconography of Maasaw and I add to it the fire and the color red mentioned before in the Wikipedia page, it’s becoming more than obvious Maasaw is a Horned Serpent warrior from the Evil Clan. He’s got the Antelope Clan antlers on his helmet. He is holding a staff weapon. The rattle can be associated either with snakes/serpents or to the crackling sound of Fire. His teeth are the fangs of the Serpent. The bones and skulls he either holds in his left hand or are hanging from his belt are a macabre sign he is a bringer of death.

“His physical appearance was so horrifying that many of the Hopi Indians ran. Some of the Hopi had the courage to stay because they had been looking for him for such a long time. They wanted to listen to Maasaw and receive spiritual wisdom.

The remarkable encounter with Maasaw is one of the reasons why the Hopi are today considered keepers of sacred knowledge.”

>> Darkness has its wisdom too you know, but it’s a twisted psychotic one. And….the “sacred knowledge” here is obviously referring to the same “secret knowledge” the Bloodlines have been sooo keen on preserving and keep hidden from the rest of the world = it’s the secret sacred knowledge of the Evil Clan. I’m also curious about something: whom is it that considers the Hopi as keepers of sacred knowledge nowadays? = the Bloodlines or (((their))) paid experts? See how (((they))) promote (((their))) cult, while crushing into oblivion the Cahokia/Rock Lake sites which are clearly connected with the ThunderBirds.

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