Penn Jillette on Trump supporters…
Is our ability to internalize counterfactuals a problem for society?
Well, that’s interesting. One of the most important things society needs is agreement on how we determine truth. It does seem that there are people who disagree not on the facts — we don’t care about that — but on how you ascertain whether something is true. But I’m also a little skeptical about how much that gets underlined for entertainment.
What do you mean?
We know a guy walked into that pizza place with a gun because of Pizzagate. We know he believed in that. We also know that hundreds of thousands of people knew about the Pizzagate conspiracy idea. But those are two very different facts. We don’t know how many of the people who knew about Pizzagate shrugged it off. All we know is that one guy took it seriously. Probably more than one guy did, but it’s very hard to get real data on that. It’s like how I have all these friends who have a clear vision of who a Trump supporter is — with no evidence that the person they’re imagining actually exists.
So what you’re saying is that you’re skeptical that there’s been a shift, which is often attributed to Trumpism, in those people’s willingness to believe things at odds with facts?
But when you say “those people” you’ve made a huge error because there are no “those people.” They don’t exist. You hear stuff like, “Trump supporters are homophobic. Trump supporters are misogynist.” This is a mistake that was made by Democrats. They would accuse Trump supporters of being things that Trump supporters knew they weren’t. There are Trump supporters that have best friends who have gay sex. They do. You can’t put a “they”-type thing on that. For 50 million years our biggest problems were too few calories, too little information. For about 50 years our biggest problem has been too many calories, too much information. We have to adjust, and I believe we will really fast. I also believe it will be wicked ugly while we’re adjusting.
How will that ugliness manifest itself?
Donald Trump.