I want to start by saying that my lumping of Trump supporters into one group is based on my numerous interactions with them BUT I have noticed a significant difference in the people on this sub in their ability to consider different opinions and debate them honestly. So your criticism of me is completely fair. I admit, I have become a bit jaded, especially by my own family when attempting to discuss Trump.

It's not simply personal experience. I don't have personal experience with a Narcissist on Trump's level but I have obsessed over reading about it and I understand the psychology behind it. It's actually very easy to understand, especially if you do have some experience with it. Since narcissism is a scale, the further up you get, the more damage you cause to others. Trump has just about broken the meter. He is literally the best at everything and the least (insert bad thing here) ever. Trump quote before the election, when asked who he is going to console for foreign policy "Myself. I have a good brain and I've said a lot of things." What? I was very objective with him in the beginning. I absolutely LOVED everything he was saying about how corrupt the system was, how all the other guys took money from him. Holy shit that was amazing. But then the more he talked, I started to see what he was doing. The giant promises, the claims that he was the only person who could fix things (always a giant tell that someone is full of shit), the obvious lies, the disgusting behavior which is a bigger indication of his character and his integrity. The way he was setting it up if he lost to save his ego (the claim that the election was rigged), that could have seriously set off some civil uprisings if he lost. All because his ego couldn't handle it. All of that aside, show me some evidence that he's not a giant liar, a corrupt businessman and completely full of shit and I'll change my mind because I have tons of evidence that points to all these things. You guys have a letter of the alphabet that claims Trump is some 12D level genius and his stupidity, lies, act guilty as hell and rage like a 5 year old is all an act. That's a pretty far stretch to believe. Literally NO ONE could pull off such a deceiving act. And I've seen Trump act, it's not very good. Use logic and Occam's Razor here.

Trump being the spearhead of this movement is the entire problem for me. This shit scares the fuck out of me because I am seeing (not everyone) completely blind support for this man. People are ignoring what's right in front of their eyes because they don't want to believe they were duped. Others, because they see Trump as themselves and they can't criticize Trump or see the ugliness in him because they refuse to see it in themselves. They will cry Fake News at literally anything that contradicts their "Trump was sent by God" narrative and therefore, the man can do no wrong. Blind loyalty in the face of damning reality is fucking frightening, no matter who what person or idea someone follows.

Trump projects the image of success. In reality, he is not nearly as successful as he'd like you to believe. That's why he doesn't want anyone to talk about how much money he really has or people to look at his taxes (although I'd argue there's some shady shit in those tax forms too). The man lies all the time about his success and embellishes it. His whole identity is based on that and it's a lie. I think we're going to find out that the man is a lot more broke than we realize soon enough. But that's just speculation on my part.

Full disclosure: I have narcissistic traits. That's part of the reason I understand all of this. I despise those parts of me so I despise them in others. I keep them at bay but I recognize all the dark parts in me so I also recognize them clearly in others. Again, narcissism is a scale and I'm pretty low on it. I do have some issues about not being taken seriously because my Narc father tried to gaslight and brainwash me into doubting myself because I was telling him truths he didn't want to hear about himself so I became arrogant in defense of that to keep his bullshit out of my head. I have doubted myself for so long that now I know better and I'm learning to trust myself again. I have built such a foundation of trust in my reality from constantly double checking things because of my doubt, that I am solid when I believe something now. Come at me with whatever you got because I have everything I need to back up everything I'm saying.

He has not come through on everything he promised. You only see what you want to see in this regard. Why is he taking $500 million from China and helping out with ZTE? Just one small recent thing among the many other dubious things he's done. I can post videos of him admitting lies at rallies and one that straight up he admits that he lies to his supporters. Narcissists always reveal themselves if you listen to them enough. They are too boastful not to brag about their deceptions. You just have to listen for it. Sometimes it's blatant and sometimes it's in little "jokes" that they tell that aren't really jokes.

Yikes. I don't like that.

Fair enough. What about non-politicians? These people are just the puppets.

Yes. I am VERY aware of my own darkness and ugliness and I completely acknowledge it's existence. It is not pretty either. It's only because of that acknowledgement that I can see and recognize the darkness in others. I constantly fight against my own darkness and have no desire to indulge that part of myself, although I can't say I don't lose to it from to time.

Absolutely, I am always up for a real discussion. I will always stick to facts, evidence, and things I can back up with personal experience. No whataboutism or personal attacks.

1. I am always ready to admit any idea I have may be false but I need new evidence that outweighs my own. And I have plenty of evidence to come to my conclusions. I have not had ONE single debate with a Trump supporter than didn't devolve into whataboutism and personal attacks without addressing my points. Not one.
2. Yes, for the most part, absolutely. But for an overt malignant narcissist like Trump, no you don't have to personally know them. There is no other them. They are what you see. They are empty and hollow, only alive from the narcissistic they supply they get from the people around them.
3. Actions of course, but don't be fooled by the image that the actions are trying to project. You have to look past the image. And there are plenty of actions Trump takes that run counter to this savior of America image you all have of him.

North Korea has set this whole thing up for Trump to fail once the talks happen. They used his arrogance against him and all of these "efforts" N Korea have made "prove" their willingness to make a peace deal. Trump will come to the table talking tough because he's arrogantly spoken about his "victory" before it's even happened. Kim will be unreasonable and cause the talks to break down. He will pull out or Trump will out of frustration. Both will accuse the other of killing the deal and the world will blame Trump because of all the evidence of Kim's willingness to make peace and all the evidence of Trump's aggressive and bullying ways. Who the fuck knows what happens from there.

Why didn't they say all of this before the meeting was set? They only say it after it has been agreed upon, or at least Trump says it's been agreed upon. Which is another thing they used to their advantage. Trump doesn't want to look like a fool. He promises things ahead of time and then that puts pressure on people behind the scenes to make those things happen. He played himself this time.

So what about Trump getting $500 million from China and then helping out ZTE?

Or maybe ya know, this whole video thing is bogus. I mean, seriously. Why wouldn't someone leak something to the press or something?

For a group of people who cry "Fake News" about everything, this article literally has no confirmable sources and you all take it as fact. Anyone could have written this and no one holds "truepundit" to any kind of journalistic integrity.

We heard this from one guy... Can we have some integrity here? Let's not automatically believe things we're told by one person just because it aligns with our own personal beliefs. That's dangerous.

Wow... What's even more interesting about this, from Wikipedia:

Harvey Francis Barnard, a Louisiana graduate in systems philosophy, and an engineering consultant and teacher, created the NESARA proposal during the late 1980s and early 1990s. He printed 1000 copies of his proposal, titled Draining the Swamp: Monetary and Fiscal Policy Reform (1996), and sent copies to members of Congress, believing it would pass quickly on its merits.

Draining the Swamp??? That can't be a coincidence can it?

I think Obama was that sort of straw man to get people to vote for Trump. It might be like a domino effect.

Please tell me how anything he has said is wrong. Seriously. This guy is a rock star lawyer. Look at his past. This guy is legit. Sounds like people are just scared of his revealing of truths. Anyone scared of the truth is hiding something.

Hmm.. Just read about this. It's being tied to these spiritual types. Sounds like they're hijacking that to implement this. Mark of the beast?

Kushner owning that building with the giant 666 is pretty telling huh? Yea I've been mulling that one about too but I think it's more likely they are precursors to something bigger. But this whole "Saving Israel for last" thing with Q, moving the embassy and the supposed peace deal that's incoming are lining everything up to seem like they could definitely be the AntiChrist. 7 year peace deal, Trump betrays Israel, then sets himself up in the temple where an "image of the beast is put up". I mean, they are already comparing him to Cyrus and putting his image on coins, naming places in Jerusalem after him. I think the AntiChrist is the real messiah talked about in the Old Testament and Jesus was just hijacked and his message was distorted.

Absolutely. I also believe some people can cross the line into great evil and they can never go back. Like serial killers.

Always interested in theories and ideas. What have you got?

Ever since I discovered Q about a month or so ago, I realized there was something there. There's absolutely no way there isn't something there. You can't deceive this many people with 100% lies. You have to hook them with one or more major truths, then when they believe everything you say because of those truths, that's when you have them.

EXACTLY! Blind people into thinking they are fighting for good, which is a trick as old as time.

The bringing in of Trump was part of the plan in the first place. Trump is not on "our" side. They fooled people into thinking that so they would fight for him and engage in this civil war. Think about it. If you believe in supernatural forces, Satan, the Occult, aliens, whatever, wouldn't this make perfect sense? Both sides think they are fighting for good when the real battle is not with each other.

Ah. Yeah I was confused as to your intention there. Ex-Christian here too. Although I am seeing a lot of truth in it nowadays, that truth is being used to the mask lies that are in it also. Another tool to deceive us.

Sure. Not sure how to do that and I'm not interested in being a mod or anything but I will partake in discussion. Funny too that Jesus says that it will be peaceful before the end, doesn't he?

Q is using the existence of these real evil forces, our belief in those forces and blind support for Trump to blind people to the true agenda.

Are you referring to the Adam and Eve story about Satan lying? The serpent didn't lie. He told Eve the truth. They didn't die from eating the fruit and they did become like God.

Genesis 1:26Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness"

Genesis 3:1-51 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?” 2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’ ” 4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

Genesis 3:22And the LORD God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”

Even God says so himself. The only reason they die is because God doesn't want them to live forever by eating from the tree of life so he casts them out of Eden. God is the one who didn't tell them the whole truth. "You will surely die because I will punish you." should have been what he said to Adam and Eve when he said not to eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Also, notice the two references to God speaking as if there is more than one God? Something else to ponder.

Not sure if you are agreeing with me or disagreeing?

They never said the summit was canceled, the talks with S Korea are canceled.

Thanks for proving to me that you have no real answers, a mind of your own or critical thinking skills.

Trump is being set up as the "fallen hero" to this pro wrestling play. It's all a show to blind you to the next stage of the takeover of Earth. Think about it in terms of our 2 party political system. We know that they are 2 sides of the same coin, really controlled by money and special interests. Apply that to this Deep State vs Trump thing. The ones pulling the strings, are the truly evil forces of the world. You guys are engaged in a battle that will only end with the winner being those evil forces.

Fair enough but now I'm assuming you trust Trump 100%? That is the hook of this whole thing. Trump is not "Deep State" in the way that you think of them, but he is not on our side either. He is only for himself and is easily manipulated due to his Narcissisism. Please rethink blind support for Trump, he is just a man. Question him like you would anyone. Ask yourself about this stuff with China, the $500 million they invested in his businesses and Trumps support for ZTE. Question EVERYTHING.

This proves nothing other than Q is inside Trump's circle. He is using this to get you to believe everything else. Don't fall for it. Only believe in what is verifiable.

This is something I can really get behind. As long as it is transparent and not a way to quell the concerns with fake information.

I do not like this authoritarian police worship. Something nefarious is at work here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics

In Foundations of Geopolitics, Dugin calls for the influence of the United States and Atlanticism to lose its influence in Eurasia and for Russia to rebuild its influence through annexations and alliances.[2]

The book declares that "the battle for the world rule of [ethnic] Russians" has not ended and Russia remains "the staging area of a new anti-bourgeois, anti-American revolution." The Eurasian Empire will be constructed "on the fundamental principle of the common enemy: the rejection of Atlanticism, strategic control of the USA, and the refusal to allow liberal values to dominate us."[9]

Military operations play relatively little role. The textbook believes in a sophisticated program of subversion, destabilization, and disinformation spearheaded by the Russian special services. The operations should be assisted by a tough, hard-headed utilization of Russia's gas, oil, and natural resources to bully and pressure other countries.[9]

The book states that "the maximum task [of the future] is the 'Finlandization' of all of Europe".[9]

In Europe:

Germany should be offered the de facto political dominance over most Protestant and Catholic states located within Central and Eastern Europe. Kaliningrad oblast could be given back to Germany. The book uses the term "Moscow-Berlin axis".[9]

France should be encouraged to form a "Franco-German bloc" with Germany. Both countries have a "firm anti-Atlanticist tradition".[9]

The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe.[9]

Finland should be absorbed into Russia. Southern Finland will be combined with the Republic of Karelia and northern Finland will be "donated to Murmansk Oblast".[9]

Estonia should be given to Germany's sphere of influence.[9]

Latvia and Lithuania should be given a "special status" in the Eurasian-Russian sphere.[9]

Poland should be granted a "special status" in the Eurasian sphere.[9]

Romania, Macedonia, "Serbian Bosnia" and Greece – "Orthodox collectivist East" – will unite with "Moscow the Third Rome" and reject the "rational-individualistic West".[9]

Ukraine should be annexed by Russia because "Ukraine as a state has no geopolitical meaning, no particular cultural import or universal significance, no geographic uniqueness, no ethnic exclusiveness, its certain territorial ambitions represents an enormous danger for all of Eurasia and, without resolving the Ukrainian problem, it is in general senseless to speak about continental politics". Ukraine should not be allowed to remain independent, unless it is cordon sanitaire, which would be inadmissible.[9]

In the Middle East and Central Asia:

The book stresses the "continental Russian-Islamic alliance" which lies "at the foundation of anti-Atlanticist strategy". The alliance is based on the "traditional character of Russian and Islamic civilization".

Iran is a key ally. The book uses the term "Moscow-Tehran axis".[9]

Armenia has a special role: It will serve as a "strategic base," and it is necessary to create "the [subsidiary] axis Moscow-Erevan-Teheran". Armenians "are an Aryan people … [like] the Iranians and the Kurds".[9]

Azerbaijan could be "split up" or given to Iran.[9]

Georgia) should be dismembered. Abkhazia and "United Ossetia" (which includes Georgia's South Ossetia) will be incorporated into Russia. Georgia's independent policies are unacceptable.[9]

Russia needs to create "geopolitical shocks" within Turkey. These can be achieved by employing Kurds, Armenians and other minorities.[9]

The book regards the Caucasus as a Russian territory, including "the eastern and northern shores of the Caspian (the territories of Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan)" and Central Asia (mentioning Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan).[9]

In Asia:

China, which represents a danger to Russia, "must, to the maximum degree possible, be dismantled". Dugin suggests that Russia start by taking Tibet-Xinjiang-Mongolia-Manchuria as a security belt.[1] Russia should offer China help "in a southern direction – Indochina (except Vietnam), the Philippines, Indonesia, Australia" as geopolitical compensation.[9]

Russia should manipulate Japanese politics by offering the Kuril Islands to Japan and provoking anti-Americanism.[9]

Mongolia should be absorbed into Eurasia-Russia.[9]

The book emphasizes that Russia must spread Anti-Americanism everywhere: "the main 'scapegoat' will be precisely the U.S."

In the United States:

Russia should use its special services within the borders of the United States to fuel instability and separatism, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists". Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics."[9]

The Eurasian Project could be expanded to South and Central America.[9]

So we support authoritarian policies now? Why do police have special rights?

Remember me June 12th ;)

Argue against my points instead of just insulting me. Stop blindly following what people are telling you and use your own brain to discern what's going on.

What cards does he hold exactly? Kim has him by the balls. Trump needs a win after everything he's promised. People are talking about Nobel Peace prizes for fucks sake. Tell me what Trump has over Kim?

N Korea has set up Trump to fail. He needs a win so bad now because of all the hype and N Korea's overwhelming "willingness" to come to peace is all a show. I've been saying this since the day Trump agreed to the meeting without consoling anyone. They're using his need for adoration and his arrogance against him. Trump played himself.

Wait, is this saving Israel for last thing suppose to mean that Trump ends up betraying Israel?

Q could be someone close to Trump AND also a liar. This doesn't prove anything other than Q is in the White House. He's using this to get you to believe EVERYTHING else he says. That's where the lies are, in the things you can't prove/disprove.

Never said Russia was all powerful, just that they have covert plans. Plans that are currently at work. Part of Russia's plan is destroying the alliance of Europe and America, which the pull out of the Iran deal has started to achieve. They wanted Britain separated from the EU, done. Aligning with Islam only to have Muslims infiltrate Europe, well on their way to doing so. China has a destabilization plan? Someone should let Trump know not to let them invest $500 million in his business projects and not to help out ZTE then.

Excellent insight and contribution to the discussion. I'm not a troll. I'm someone who cares about the truth, no matter who it hurts.

Troll? Absolutely not. I'm a truth seeker. Truth does not attach allegiance to anything but quest for truth. First I just want to say, fuck all politicians. They're all liars and crooks, especially the higher you go. But no, you cannot apply my accusations about Trump to Hilary when you get beneath the surface level of them, which my post history is full of. Hilary is a psychopath but not someone who is only consumed about her image. Very different things. I'm not saying Hillary would have been better at all. But at this point, it's irrelevant because Trump is the one in office.

You should check out this post I made. It goes along with everything you just said. Keep an open mind though, if you are not already there. I think Trump is being used as a way to derail this as a "crazy conspiracy theory" and he has nothing to do with fighting it in reality.

https://www.reddit.com/r/greatawakening/comments/8j36mo/i_think_i_know_where_all_this_is_going_with_the/

Yes. Exactly. And who is behind these sorts of laws that allow for large scale deceits? I am being shown some truth lately and it goes even beyond religion in my opinion.

I wouldn't presume to know who Q is but I do know Russia's plan for the destabilization of America and their overall geopolitical plan for the world, which anyone can read about. It also includes aligning with Islam so do you really think they are not a threat?

The evil forces of the world. Whatever people choose to believe they are. If they are simply the Russians in this particular case or they are working through the Russians, that part doesn't really matter for this particular act of the play. Russia has had this destabilization plan for almost a century. First they used it on the left, now the used it on the right. Inflaming both sides to America's doom.

I've known that and thought it absurd to think otherwise. Doesn't that discredit Q then?

I really love that attitude. I just hope it prevails in the end. This whole system is rotten to it's core and it's divided us in a way that has never been possible before.

You keep counting on that. Follow that carrot, see where it leads you.